nevchewy Posted June 22, 2005 Author Report Share Posted June 22, 2005 Sorry I didn't call you back yesterday... I got home around 10 - 10:30 and with the hour difference to Winnipeg... I didn't want to bother you if it was too late. I'm not worried yet. Like hung said... if it spreads, then I'll be quite mad. I have the ones with the black blotches in a hospital tank as you can see in the pics above. I started treating coppersafe last night, so we'll see. Nothing against your fish or services at all James! You have been awesome to deal with and I have no complaints at all, just the one concern of the black stuff spreading. This would be wouldn't be your fault though, as I should have quarantined before releasing in my main tank. Newbie mistake! It's the chance we take with shipping I guess. I'd rather this than the whole lot turning up dead, and being out $240. If it is a parasite though... it must have been from your water or tank. there is no other explanation, and I hope this doesn't happen again to anyone! I hope other people do not get discouraged in ordering from you again because of this! Your breeding colony's are some of the best I have seen based on the pictures you sent to me. This is not a question of quality or your customer service, as they are top notch and I would be happy to deal with you again in the future! Others seem to be happy with your fish, and because of the saulosi's that I have been searching high and low for, I'm happy camper. I'll post that pic for you tonight (its a good one, best looking rusty i have ever seen!!!!). If anyone wants to see it right away... PM me with your email address and i'll send it right away for you. Thanks again James for you call last night! Just more proof that you are working to make the customer happy! nev Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xlonelycruiserx Posted June 22, 2005 Report Share Posted June 22, 2005 Pretty sure they're a red-top afra variant (not too sure what's up with the galileya [not sure if it's a y or r, that's how they pronounced it], but that's what Stuart's guys called them as well). Yeah, their a cyno afra variant that has been quite new. Krista (fish manager at sunridge) got the WC parents and i happened to see the pics and i think its a really cool looking fish. so happy that i got 10 of my own. now hopefully nothing will happpen to them. Hung Ps. James, although the yellow princesses were pretty small, i'm happy witht he quality Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dunl Posted June 22, 2005 Report Share Posted June 22, 2005 Hung, send some pics when you can....thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nevchewy Posted June 22, 2005 Author Report Share Posted June 22, 2005 Here is another post i found on CF about the black spots... it doesn't look like its anything to worry about. I hope they are right! http://www.cichlid-forum.com/phpBB/viewtop...ck+spot+disease nev Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RD. Posted June 22, 2005 Report Share Posted June 22, 2005 Nothing to worry about? If nothing else they are unsightly, and make your fish look like crap. If they are in fact parasitic in nature, and not dealt with accordingly, then there is risk of them transferring to the rest of your fish. (which in some cases has indeed happened) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nevchewy Posted June 22, 2005 Author Report Share Posted June 22, 2005 Nothing to worry about? when i say that... i mean its not terminal. That i'm not going to go home and find all of my fish dead in the water. I agree it's still a problem... but i'm hoping by seperating and treating the affected few, that it will not spread to cause even more problems to my main tank. If i knew for sure that it is only skin deep and will go away and not be a problem at all to my other fish... I could then sleep easy tonight. sorry for the miscommunication, I'm just looking for the light at the end of the tunnel! I'll post pics after a week to see if the coppersafe is helping. nev Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Krystle Posted June 22, 2005 Report Share Posted June 22, 2005 it could also be healing ammonia burns, which could certainly happen during shipping as the water quality degrades in the bag. Ammonia burns show up as black marks, and are due to melanophore migration. I'll try to find a link on them because I'm not the best at explaining "I bought a fish two weeks ago, and a few days after I bought it and carried it home, it started developing dark black patches on its body, especially on it's back and sides. After a week, the patches began to fade, now it's almost all orange again! What gives?"ANSWER: What you were seeing is called a "MELANOPHORE MIGRATION" - It's caused by *any* chemical or traumatic irritant or injury on the surface of the fishes' bodies. Some good & very common causes include: #1 cause: High Ammonia concentration in water Low pH causes irritation Fluke parasitism causes trauma Ich or Costia infestation causes trauma *HOWEVER*- the black color does not come until the irritant is REMOVED and the healing process begins. Therefore, it is safe to assume that the fish *was* in bad water or under severe stress until you bought it, and the melanophore migration came and went as usual, starts as healing starts, comes on over two weeks, resides for a week or more, and clears within three to six weeks. from www.koivet.com I'm assuming we can rule out parasites for now as the fish aren't showing any other symptoms than the black spots, right? If they are ammonia burns from shipping, they're basically scars and will heal up just fine with clean water. I've had fish with ammonia burns before, they aren't really anything to worry about as long as you have water quality firmly under control. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RD. Posted June 22, 2005 Report Share Posted June 22, 2005 (edited) I've seen a lot of fish shipped, from a lot further away than MB, and I have never seen a fish with black spots/blotches such as these. Ammonia burn, possible, parasites, IMO, more probable. Nev - I seriously doubt that your fish will die from this, but at the same time I wanted to make sure that you removed these fish from your main tank as I have seen this spread within a tank. The fact that it can spread to healthy fish (as has been reported on several threads on CF) tends to rule out ammonia burn. Let us know how it all turns out ..... Edited June 22, 2005 by RD. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Krystle Posted June 22, 2005 Report Share Posted June 22, 2005 I completely agree, the fish should definitely be quarantined Don't get me wrong, I was not saying that the fish has ammonia burns, just that they could be a possibility. I wasn't familiar with the threads on cichlid forum, and since you're more experienced with cichlids, I would also lean towards your assessment of the fish Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xlonelycruiserx Posted June 22, 2005 Report Share Posted June 22, 2005 Hung, send some pics when you can....thanks! will do in a couple days here once i'm done with the blackspots problem. Â risk of them transferring to the rest of your fish. (which in some cases has indeed happened) Too late for me now. I've noticed now that 2 of my galileo red tops have it now (GOD DAM) But in conclusion i think that it is more likely to happen to mbuna sp. because these guys were in there with juvies Albino eureka reds, and Aul. Maleri. and the yellow princesses. but none of those guys got it.... But none the less i'm not very happy right now :guns: . gotta go grab some coppersafe and treat it just in case. better safe than sorry. damn it HUng Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nevchewy Posted June 23, 2005 Author Report Share Posted June 23, 2005 Sorry to hear! so far, i have isolated it to only 3 fish and they are now seperated. I keep digging for more information and i found a bit more on this disease: http://www.cichlid-forum.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=85742 Fish Phenom posted a pic on what Black Spot disease looks like. We do not have anything like that! Not sure what is going on anymore! nev Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RD. Posted June 23, 2005 Report Share Posted June 23, 2005 (edited) Nev ..... As previously stated, you will most likely never know what it is, unless you do a tissue scraping, and have it analyzed by someone who's qualified in this area. What we do know is that it has now spread to two of Hung's mbuna, so it's not simply 'tissue damage', or ammonia burn. Edited June 23, 2005 by RD. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dunl Posted June 23, 2005 Report Share Posted June 23, 2005 Contagious, eh? Wouldn't it be showing up in James's other fish then? Had to come from somewhere, and I assuming it wasn't from the bags. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nevchewy Posted June 23, 2005 Author Report Share Posted June 23, 2005 so it's not simply 'tissue damage', or ammonia burn. I know... that is why i took your advice and went out and bought coppersafe as suggested. i'm going to treat my 90 gallon tank too. so far i didn't spread to any other of my Mbuna and the saulosi's from james are perfectly fine. nev Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RD. Posted June 23, 2005 Report Share Posted June 23, 2005 Yes, it does seem odd that these fish showed no signs of these 'black spots/blotches' when bagged, but within a few hours of being bagged, there are suddenly fish covered in them. Very odd indeedy ........ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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