Hippoherder

River shrimp? I don't think I've seen shrimp around here. So you mean fairy shrimp?

The ponds are still producing daphnia and such but now is the time to harvest river shrimp find a small pool of water with a little current and cash in

Can't find the link yet but here is a quote from a discussion on breeding them:

"Male lyretail swordtails are incapable of reproducing. The mutation that causes the extended fins also causes the anal fin to become extremely elongated and there by not able to function properly. So male high fin lyretails while incredibly beautiful are completely useless for breeding. You have to use standard fin or high fin males with the lyretail females to get babies. "

I had read that they couldn't breed because of an overdeveloped gonopodium ... not sure what is true.

I can tell you my males have absolutely no interest in the females in my tank.

could somebody please link the articles regarding this swordtail type not being able to breed? i'm quite interested in reading them! thanks.

Wow, I have a new appreciation for all the great shots I have seen on here. I have about 40 blurry pictures and maybe 3 that look in focus. These are a couple of the fish I got at the auction. I beleive they are Red eye, hi fin, lyretail swordtails. I'm calling them Jaws and Mongo

Here is Mongo

Here is Jaws

I was trying to get some pictures of some rainbows and ricefish, but all I got is color streak, action shots lol. Its a start

First thing i did was go out and get these guys a couple of girlfriends but from what I have been reading, I don't think they will be passing their genetics on anytime soon.

Thanks everyone. I will go with those reccomendations. I am currently running more than a 2 degree difference so it is time to do a serious upgrade.

Thanks again!

Bill

I've got several heaters and 3 thermometers and I can't get any thermometer to agree on whatthe temp is in any tank. The heaters i have also seem to be unreliable. One thinks the lowest setting it has is for a discus tank and the others never seem to get to the temp that corresponds to the setting on the device. Can someone reccomend a reliable brand or method? Is digital better?

Hey all, I recently (awhile back actually) picked up a 60g tank and am just getting around to setting it up. I have the heater, substrate, hood/lights, etc but I'm trying to make a decision on a filtration setup. I was at our local Home Hardware the other day and they had a canister filter designed for a pond on for half price, 160$. The price is fantastic but the flow-rate is published as 900gph. Is this too much? Is anyone else here running something over-filterered this badly? I'm really worried about the water movement since I will be going with a sand bottom and will be stocking with either Angelfish or with my Saulosi's which are ready for a larger tank. Thoughts?

Unless i am misunderstanding, your turnouver rate is 15x per hour. That is actually the reccomended turnover rate for seahorses (10-15X), which have poor swimming ability. Granted, fresh water is different than salt, but if you are providing an area of low flow with landscaping I don't see why it should be an issue. I am running about 7X in a 50g fresh and it is bareley enough to budge some of the plants about. The filter I am picking up will be 700gph on a 50 and I am not giving it a second thought. Just provide some sheltered area with landscaping and you should be fine.

Went to the auction today and finally got my membership in CAS. It was my first fish auction and came away with 5 things I was really happy with...2 lots of rice fish, some vals, rainbows, and some lyre tail swords. I was tryig to be careful size-wise, but when I got home I soon found the vals and Sowrds to be a bit large for my tank. Live and learn. Couldn't resist the lyre tails as they looked incredible. I am very happy with everything I got and the auction itself.

Thanks to everyone that helped make it happen!

I am likely going to go with the RP3 sump filter for a 93 gallon seahorse/ shrimp tank. I like the built in skimmer and the flow rate is just about perfect for the seahorses at about 8x. Anyone have any experience with this ot opinions on this model? It's a bit pricey but I have only ever read good things so far.

Here is the Big al's link:

http://www.bigalspets.ca/Tom-Aquatics-RP3-Filter/dp/B002V3GW9C?ie=UTF8&id=Tom%20Aquatics%20RP3%20Filter&field_product_site_launch_date_utc=-1y&field_availability=-1&field_browse=3098349011&searchSize=12&searchNodeID=3098349011&searchPage=1&refinementHistory=brandtextbin%2Csubjectbin%2Ccolor_map%2Cprice%2Csize_name&searchRank=salesrank

Thanks, that clears things up a bit. If I ever get seahorses breeding I will go with a more complicated structure. I guess I will go with a more complicated structure for anything I get that has a clearly defined genetic line.

In the aquarium hobby, it is typically implied that the F number is the generational gap from te wild.

It could also be used in a way similar to te other tracking method you mentioned. For example, if you get a pair of guppies from a world renowned breeder, and you want to let peoe know the purity of their strain, you could say that the parents are F0 from Big Breeder, the kids you get from them would be F1 from Big Breeder, etc.

So, every fish that is not bred with a parent or sibling would be an F-0?

THanks for the quick 101 on this. I've asked a few people and everyone has told me that it is tracking how far from wild caught specimens.

The "F-system" is used to track generations.

P1 (Parental 1) x P2 (Parental 2)

V

F1 "Then each individual offspring described by whatever genotype/phenotype you desire"

F1 will include any fish bred from your P1 & P2 at any date.

Your Parentals can be whatever you like. Wild-caught or aquarium bred.

F2 starts when you take one of the F1 and cross it to someone else. Whether its a back cross to one of the parents, or a incross to a sibiling, or even an outcross.\

Same idea with F3.

Out of curiousity do you remember why these people think "F3's are to shallow into the pool?"

"CAS/BB/01" could be a way you name/number each individual fish or generation of fish coupled with the F system.

The gene pool doesn't get "diluted" unless you keep incrossing your fish for several generations without sufficient outcrossing.

The F number of a fish is still important, allows you to map out the family history of your line. The map of that history is actually what a pedigree is.

I guess i really don't see the point of the F-system then. I would keep a pedigree if i felt it was important. I know the gene pool doesn't get diluted unless there are multiple inbreedings. That is why I think pedigree is important.

The "F-system" is used to track generations.

P1 (Parental 1) x P2 (Parental 2)

V

F1 "Then each individual offspring described by whatever genotype/phenotype you desire"

F1 will include any fish bred from your P1 & P2 at any date.

Your Parentals can be whatever you like. Wild-caught or aquarium bred.

F2 starts when you take one of the F1 and cross it to someone else. Whether its a back cross to one of the parents, or a incross to a sibiling, or even an outcross.\

Same idea with F3.

Out of curiousity do you remember why these people think "F3's are to shallow into the pool?"

"CAS/BB/01" could be a way you name/number each individual fish or generation of fish coupled with the F system.

The gene pool doesn't get "diluted" unless you keep incrossing your fish for several generations without sufficient outcrossing.

The F number of a fish is still important, allows you to map out the family history of your line. The map of that history is actually what a pedigree is.

I understand the F1, F2, F3 system. I am not sure if F3 becomes aquarium strain automatically or if we just call it aquarium strain if we can't verify lineage. I am under the impression that the "F" system is a way to track genetics. I have heard a few people mention that they thought F3's were going a bit too far into the shallow end of the pool for them... If I'm not mistaken about this (the "F' system being used to track genetics), isn't it a bit flawed? If we get a couple of F1's and their spawn is given out by the bucket load, then we have kind of made the gene pool quite a bit shallower all on our own.

I was just pondering if I imported an F-0 (wild fish), wouldn't it be better to track the line instead of how far removed from the wild? For instance, if we break it down by aquarium club, original keeper, genetic line and I imported a fish that was wild, it might be labeled as :

CAS/BB/01 (Calgary aquarium society, my initials, line 1)

This way the F-whatever status wouldn't matter, because if we had a pedigree, an F-5 pairing with varied genetics is just as valuable to promoting diversity...just a thought. With habitat and wild populations getting rapidly reduced, I think keeping track and maintaining diversity becomes that much more important in the aquarium.

I'm envious The closest thing I got to witness back in new york was pipefish...still cool, but not the same.

I recently had the privilege of spending about 10 minutes with a wild seahorse in Cuba. I always thought they were beautiful but seeing them in the wild is truly amazing!

I'm making the slow transition into salt with an endgame of keeping and breeding seahorses. I am just curious if anyone here keeps them, and is or has been breedinging them. Please comment on your setup and species if you don't mind.

Thanks

Ok. If you have a well planted tank your shrimp population should steadily increase. An adult shrimp might occassionally get harrassed but they won't be any worse for wear. A baby shrimp might...might get eaten but in a well planted tank you probably won't see them until they are out of the snack size phase.

thanks for the quick reply wcmm = white cloud mountain minnows

WCMM? The shrimp are totally fine with the eggs. I even ended up putting some in my breeder net with rainbow eggs. They might clean them but won't touch a viable egg to eat it. Ramshors will also not touch the eggs as I also had them in the net and running crazy in the tank where rainbows would hatchout all the time. Now in another tank, the introduction of apple snails and BN plecos to the tank led to almost total onsumption of the eggs. I cannot say for certain if it was the apples, the plecos or both that were chowing down on the eggs.

You are fine with the shrimp though.

i also have the same question as the original poster id like to have RCS and WCWM in the same tank. My internet research has shown that the two will get along fine. What about breeding? I figure the RCS will reproduce and some shrimplets might get eaten... but probably not if the WCMM are well fed? How about the WCMM eggs? are they fair game to the RCS? i imagine they would be... anyone with experience with this?

I think I have a catch-22 for the zerocarb. If it will have the effect you say it will when i remove it, then I will have a massaive tank crash. I have 25 multiis, 12 endlers, 4 BN plecos (babies), 2 rainbows, and 2 cyps....not to mention a ridiculous amount of snails. I think I might be married to the zerocarb now.

I don't make snail jello, but the variety of things these things get to snack on is pretty diverse - golden pearl, spirulina flakes, blood worms, left over brine shrimp and daphnia, NLS... I think that is why the snails are going nuts breeding.

So far everything is healthy in the tank (except for what the multis killed). I am trying to decrease the bioload.

I wasn't worried about the apple snails as much as the trumpet snails...but a I did a rough head count and I should have well over a 100 babies. Not sure how many really. When the hatch happened it just looked like someone dumped tapiocca in the tank. But they are tiny for now.

IMO the zeocarb media isn't good - it basically steals the ammonia from the biological bacteria, resulting in a tank that doesn't have enough bacteria to sustain the bioload. i'd remove the zeocarb and just have sponge, biomax, and polyester batting (if you care about fine particle filtration).

apple snails are pretty darn messy when they are cared for properly and are fed properly, and do add a substantial amount to the bioload. are you making calcium enriched snail jello for them?

from my research and experience (raised 7 generations of apple snails), about 2 gallons per snail is good for smaller tanks, and once you hit the 40 gallon and up range you can get away with a few more apples in the tank. i had about 30 adult apples in a standard 55 gallon at one point, with a fairly good fish load in there too. all were perfectly healthy, although my nitrate level on that tank was constantly higher.

My snails are a bit out of control...more malasian trumpet snails that I can count, 6-8 golf ball sized apple snails, and 60 (estimate) 3 week old applle snails all in a 50 gallon. I didn't think snails posed much of a bio load. Is there a certain # per gallon that is acceptable or is the general # neglible? I have a 40 gallon and 50 gallon HOB filter on the tank with zerocarb media. How many snails are too many? If nothing else the multis are getting a workout picking snails up and dropping them on the other side of the tank.

I appreciate the offer. I don't see myself being able to get up to you anytime soon though. If you were to be headed down to Calgary for some reason I would imagine there would be a huge die off in the rock. I'll have to stick a little closer to home. Thaks though. I am going to start a tank going for sexy shrimp and Dwarf seahorses that I will be importing next spring. I am getting things cycled and in order well in advance. The major thing is I need to make sure there are no nasty hitchhikers that will eat seahorse fry. I can always get live rock from a lfs and have to trust it I guess. I can always clutlure deadrock from live sand. So I guess sand and water is the big thing right now - although a safe live rock source would be nice.

I started my journey into SW about 4 years ago with a 20 gallon. After setting up my 100g, my 20 sat there for a quarantine tank. DiDn't do anything with it and it kinda got away from me. Cleaned it out last weekend, new water, rock into my 100gallon sump to re-seed it and starting to cycle it again in hopes of selling it. If this is something that interest you let me know, I'm in Innisfail, an hour away from C-town.

I have 5 gertrude rainbows (had 7) in my 50 gallon with a pair of praecox, a trio of cyps, and a bunch of multis. The Gertrude rainbows must be high or living proof Darwin was wrong... 2 or 3 out of the group have taken to swimming straight up against the current of the HOB filter, turning over backwards, and then swimming straight down to the sand like a lawn dart, where they get the peas beat out of them by the multis. They don't always do it in the filter current. Sometimes they just swim to the top and then swim straight down (like 90 degreed agle) head first into the sand...and then get pounded by multis. I am down to 5 because these things just can't stay out of the Multi shells. I have a feeling there iwll be a breeding goup of rainbows in the livestock section soon.

You've got saltwater going too?

hahaha...come see me! I got some seed sand you can have! All you need is a cup...if you can find someone selling rock that is still in their system...that would be best!

Not sure where this would go (livestock classifieds, equiptment classifieds....) ...

I am looking to get a saltwater nano tank going and looking for someone in Calgary/airdrie area who might be willing to part with some live sand/rock, and possibly some well cycled water to help with a kick start. Please message me and we can work out the details.

Thanks!

We just got our electric bill and the year over year comparrison ( we got 3 tanks running in the last year ) is a bit shocking. So now the hunt to discover why the bill is o large has begun. Just curious how much everyone thinks their monthly cost to keep the tanks running might be. Of course tank size, location, and equiptment are all factors...just looking for an impression - $10/month? $20? $30?...

Sorry for the bad pics...was best I could do with one hand and a crumby camera.

I have a few oddballs like this in my tank. The only things that have ever been in the tank are cherry shrimp (predominantly), a few crs (that didn't live very long), and a few rainbow shrimp (which I don't know what happened to...

It is possible for the rainbow shrimp to cross with cherries, but arne't supposed to cross with crs... The others like this are black or so red they look black unless the light hits them the right way. They usually have some small marking...one has a white diamond on the fan of its tail, a couple that have one or two tiny white lines just above the fan of the tail. I only see these guys when I tear the tank apart (Its a fry tank that has so much hornwart you cant see a thing). I figure a crs had to cross with something it isn't supposed to...but if so, then why are they all black/super dark cherry and not the normal red? If the rainbows crossed then why the small markings?

Anyways, lots of oddballs in the tank...any ideas what this is? I've never had a cbs in the tank.

The eggs still appear viable. It shouldn't be much longer until they are due to eye up. They are a translucent yellowish color. So far impressions are that they are gertrudes...time will tell.