Evolution

If anything, a freshewater invert and herptile forum.

OMG! You could have atleast contributed to a thread else where and pretended to want to be a part of the community.

I'm argued out. I've listened to what you've said and we'll see what happens.

I got a lot of tanks to build in the next 8 months and I'm think wood would be the cheapest way to go.

So... we talking alcohol, or swallowing fish water while starting a siphon?

I almost pee'd myself! I rather deal with 6 hours of hangover than a hour of fish tank water throat rot!

Wicked picture and awesome tank!

I've used Zavlar rubber coating on my 2200 gallon build while others have used products like pond armour on thiers. I've seen people also use kerdi mat and tile thier tanks. All of these work well and will basically be up to you on whatever you feel most comfortable using.

Is your 2200g tiled?

Many of the rainbows, specifically Melanotaenia sp. and Glossolepis sp., cichlids of all sizes, but appropriately, the dwarf cichlids of South America and West Africa, other gouramis would include all the Colisa lalia variaties and Trichosis sp., most killies and many many tetras. These are all relatively common small freshwater fish groups with pretty, reflective scales. Just keep compatibilty in mind when choosing and be careful when asking staff at petstores what is compatible, make sure the person you are asking knows what they are talking about.

I think that they key is the CFIA is going to attempt to regulate this, and this attempt is going to be based entirely on a good faith system, and not much more.

I disagree, not entirely, but I disagree. There is a globalized network with the ornamental fish trade that has governments, farmers, jobers, exporters and importers alike all working together. No one wants to screw anyone, because one bad link in the chain weakens it and breaks it. The system CFIA has set up helps to keep that chain stronger.

What you are saying sounds like the CFIA would have to police the entire global network with the appropriate scientists to make their regulations work. It would be like an inspector standing at a NLS mixing vat checking every ingredient going into it. It is not possible. CFIA has to put some trust in NLS, that the ingredients listed are the ones being used to make the food, it's the law. Just like NLS puts trust in their suppliers that the product coming into their facilaty is what they asked for. CFIA can put trust into NLS because of the regulatory system in place in the US; the US has rules too, rules that are compatible to ours. And a good 75% of the fish coming into Canada either comes from the US or comes via the US. CFIA can now focus the majority of their energy and resourses at the real problem. The west coast and all the stuff coming in over there under the wire, undetected.

As for the use of taxonomy when purchasing fish for import, it is in place. When Daljeet Imports brings in electric blue crayfish from Whale Tail International they have a list to choose from. The list consists of both the nomencature of the fish and a common name. You scope the list for electric blue crayfish and beside the comon name will be the taxonomy. The list of crayfish will at any given time consist of 10-30 different availiblities of the same species to choose from. Daljeet gets to choose from about 4 different countries of origin and about 3-4 different sizes in each. The CFIA knows all this and yes, they do have faith in both these companies for obviously very good reason.

The market in Canada is small compared to the US and EU, but Whale Tail International doesn't want to loose the million $ worth of fish they sell up here every year, so they keep their side of the fence as clean as possible. The farms producing the electric blue crayfish know exactly what they are producing and they list it as exactly what it is. If they didn't, their crayfish sales would plummet. This system has been like this for 25 plus years, it isn't new.

But Jimbo's Non Business Tax Paying Back Yard Fish Imports and Silver Fish Fish Store is another story. Because Whale Tail International will not sell to them and no one in Whale's network of properly regulated fish farms and jobers will either, Jimbo and Silver are forced to use suppliers that are not inspected, monitored and regulated by governing bodies. And that is where the real problem lies. It is these guy who are likely to bring in things under the wire and cause problems for everyone else. The CFIA is going to be hard on them when they can and rightfully so. Does this mean Jimbo and Silver are going to be screwed? No, they both need to respect the rules and laws and establish themselves as trustworthy importers into Canada and then CFIA will show them the respect they earned.

You're welcome. If you try it and it works and you have C. sterbai coming out of your wazo, please sell me a dozen or 2.

I want to get a method to breeding/raising them that will garantee quality stock so for now there won't be too many at fist. I have a group of 11 that i acquired as two seperate groups in order to help with genetics in the long run.

PROFESSIONAL!

The Chinese algae eater actually comes from india and is a lousy alage eater as an adult, highly territorial and tends to be parasitic toward other fish.

You're welcome. If you try it and it works and you have C. sterbai coming out of your wazo, please sell me a dozen or 2.

It's not that I've turn a 360, but that the threats CFIA focus on, monitors and tracks and the threats importers face are different types of threats requiring different types of management. The many threats a fishroom faces are limited to effecting the fishroom and will not or cannot jump to the food chain or wild populations, but there are exceptions and that is what CFIA is regulating. Also, a species can be regulated if it is suspected of a potential threat, it doesn't have to be a known direct threat. I'm more interested in what S. discus carries that S. aquafaciatus does not and is considered or known as a threat. Is the threat from wild S.A. populations or is this something coming up and out of grow out tanks and ponds?

Then get started, I'm sure everyone wants to read about your drinking problems!

The point is everyone is responsible for the role they play. The global ecconomy is going to have some scammers about trying to make a fast buck without regard to anyone or anything other than themselves. The CFIA is not a sham and the dissension you've express in this thread for the CFIA appears to be a personal issue and not anything founding on actual facts. Most everything you've said is emotional, imagined and speculated.

I believe the CFIA is doing what it knows to be the right thing for Canada, and the very real and certified science team on staff at the CFIA knows what they are doing and how things work. If you have factual information (other then your experience with the paper work getting you product over the boarder) regarding this regulation as a CFIA sham, then I think you need to call the appropriate authorites. If not, then I think it is wise to stop spreading the discordance.

With less common cories I remove the eggs one by one with my finger tip and transplant them in a hatching tank by placing each egg exactly where I want them on the glass, which is 1 cm away from any other egg. I then put an air defuser under them, but the bubbles do not pass over the eggs but infront of them and that creates a good upcurrent preventing fungus from falling on them. I change 50% of the water every day with water that sat 24 hours with an air stone going in it. Keep the hatching tank water 4-6 degrees cooler than the ideal temperature for the adults.

Sell them for $50 each. Doing that will help bring them back and establish them as a staple ornamental pleco.

As an indication of the difficulty in treating Ich outbreaks, Xu used the example of an infection that strikes a commercial fish farming pond, which might have a surface area equal to 10 or 20 high school football fields. The typical treatment involves pouring in a solution of formaldehyde, a potentially toxic substance. Hundreds of gallons might be needed, and farmers might have to repeat the treatment several times. Even after treatment, the fish would be at risk of reinfection if they encountered the parasite again, he said.

Wow, that is a lot of meds! Cutting corners for these guys could destory their businesses!

Ich causes losses estimated at $50 million annually.

WOW that is a lot of dead fish and money! I wonder if Canada does 50 mil in fish sales a year? I wonder what percentage of fish are lost in Canada do to ich? .00001? Canada is so geographically big, yet so insignificant in the fish world.

The growth and globalization of international trade in aquatic animals has expanded rapidly over the last decade.

That means it's broader than Canada, it's world wide. That means that other countries import fish into their countries too. Some of those countries import 10,000 time more fish into their country than we do into Canada. Those countries already have systems in place. Systems that Canada will be benefiting from. We have a system that works for terrestrial animals and plants, which is going to be the same system used for fish, that systems works with other countries systems. I'm willing to bet that 75% fish that come into this country come in via the US or a US transshipper. That means the US transhipper already has a network in place that meets all the US health requirements and those requirements likely exceeds the Canadian requirements.

The CFIA has a long history of regulating the importation of terrestrial animals and animal products. As part of the new aquatic animal health program within CFIA, the proposed amendments to the Health of Animals Regulations will result in the inclusion of aquatic animals.

How will that system work for fish?

Where possible, the aquatic animal import program will build on existing program infrastructure and operational networks. Consultation with regulated parties on regulatory change has been ongoing since 2005 and will continue as formal regulatory processes proceed.

That means that the structure used for terrestrial animals and plants, that works, will be used for fish.

If anyone can prove that the existing program used for mammal, birds, sreptile, amphibians and plants is a sham then I suggest you do so, if not then your arguement is baseless and holds no ground.

And so exactly how is that going to stop Tom, Dick, and Harry from importing discus, etc, or as you suggest, help eliminate the underground fish trade into Canada?

Honestly I don't know, underground fish trade was a direct quote used by Canada's largest fish wholesaler over a phone converation with me yesterday. He was in Ottawa last week as an invited speaker for this regulation thingy that they did, he mentioned it to me. He is the same guy that gave me the info about botox in the flower horns, which was passed to him buy some guy named Dennis, i don't know, I think he owns a store in Calgary, but clearly he hasn't been set straight by you pertaining importantion of tropical fish into Canada.

And as for Tom and Hairy and Dick, well I guess I don't know how it will stop them, and I'm sitting here wondering what this conversation is even about, because all i've heard is crying going on and on about how this is going to hurt our hobby, all because of a $100 added to a box of 250 snakeskin gouramis and 11 other fish.

No, the exporter has to get a DMV to inspect the fish first and obtain a health certificate, then the exporter has to ship the fish with a health certificate. Which, you are right, is no big deal, but part of the process. Like i said before, it is not going to cost much more per fish when ordering significant quanties for resale or distribution amoungst other hobbiests. So it's about proper import procedures, not about money or BS.

Come on, how are you or anyone else going to import a discus without a certificate of health, legally? The discus and all the other fish listed and will be listed in the future, that do not have health certificates will not becoming into Canada, atleast not legally.

What I am looking for is a variety of different frozen foods specifically formulated for such fish as rays, for arrowana's, for all sizes of cichlids- one herbavor, another carnivore ( i know), and for Jumbo fishes and for small community fishes, for bottom feeders and catfish as well as a veggy one for plecos and so on. All of them having the consistancy of tofu, so when the fish eats it, it doesn't cloud the water with oils and food bits. I would like all packages in the form of cubed portions. For example I'd like the community food to be a cube of mouth sized bits when thawed and the arrowana food to be cubed in three different sizes for different growth stages of life. Same for rays and cichlids and jumbos fishes and catfishes.

If someone could get on this using RD as the nutritional and ingredient consultant that would be great.

P.s. This is a million dollar idea if produced and marketed correctly.

P.s.s. I'd do it, but I am too busy right now with 3 other businesses, I am not opposed to buying the recipes off someone or being the financial and marketing half of a business partnership.

You need to cut out a space for the filter at the back of the canopy. The canopy should have a grooved cut line where the filter fits, cut that out.

When we force guidelines upon other countries such as what is going to be happening with these new regulations, what happens is these countries begin to improve the way they catch, handle, house and ship their fish. These countries also want to become globalized, modernized and affluent and this is helping to educate them on the importance of proper procedures. The ornamental fish on the list are mostly farmed fish. Another thing this does is it helps to eliminate the underground fish trade into Canada. The Government of Canada doesn't want discus breeders (they are everywhere) or any other fish farmer who doesn't follow proper disease control procedures shipping fish into Canada.

Also, these regulations are nothing new, Canada is just catching up to the US and EU.