wandj Posted September 29, 2004 Report Share Posted September 29, 2004 Oh, more tank parameters: I am on well water. Out of the ground it is hard to very hard. 10 grains. I also have a lot of sediment...looks like coal flakes. If I don't filter my water, I get ANTS coming through the pipes! (GROSS) My well is punched through Limestone, so that explains my high pH and kH. Anyway, I soften my water so it is soft in my Zebra tank. kH is VERY high. Thus, my pH 8.5 NEVER budges. Like I said, this tub is 85 gal...maybe 70 actual water cuz it's not to the very top. I tried mixing in over half RO water to lower my pH. Total waste of time. It didn't move. So I hope the Zebra is as adaptable as they say...and will breed too! So anyway, in Zebra tank: pH 8.5 Water: soft <20 kH: over 430ppm Temp: 85F No iron or other metals that I know of. My well water goes through an earth aggregate sediment filter, then the softener. What I can't figure out, is if I measure my pH immediately out of the tap, my pH is 7.6!!! I only wish it would stay there, but after a few hours sitting in a glass (or a couple of days sitting in a big bucket) the pH ALWAYS rises up to 8.5 and stays there. My LFS could not explain this, and I have no idea why this happens. When I got my water tested by a pro when I got my water treatment equipment, the pro said my pH was 7.6. And it's NOT my test kits. I have a wide range and high range pH test-tube tests and I bought the very expensive battery powered pH meter. All 8.5 in older water. Getting off topic, but have always wondered about this. Hmmm Anybody out there have any ideas? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smokey Posted September 29, 2004 Report Share Posted September 29, 2004 wandj. thank you for the excellant posting. The pH rises _ This is a normal process. As the CO2 gasses off, the pH will rise. You stated your water paramets are: >>pH 8.5 >>Water: soft <20 >>kH: over 430ppm >>Temp: 85F....... If you drop the KH, the pH will drop and stabilize. What are you refering to with this number>>Water: soft <20. GH or ??. What equipement are you using to soften the water??. Smokey Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wandj Posted September 29, 2004 Report Share Posted September 29, 2004 Hi. I have one of those fanshy smanshy farm/acreage water softeners. Typical water softener salt. If I don't soften, I have so much Ca and Mg that I get white, flaky and heavy crud forming everywhere...especially my heaters. I know I can use peat, lava rock medium and driftwood and I have. But have not seen any results yet. I will try puttin peat in my Fluvals for sure. And thanks for the pH explanation. Now it all makes sense. I read somewhere that there is little O2 in well water...cuz it's in the ground. So now I know why the pH rises after sitting...O2 is entering/CO2 leaving. Mystery SOLVED. Thanks. I found my test results. I did them about a month or so ago. My Zebra tank dissolved O2 according to my meter is 7. I assume that's good. One of those new Milwaulki meters. (Probably spelled that wrong) If I used my RO unit, the pH is 6.9 GH is (using my softened water) 40ppm My raw (well water) GH is 220ppm My softened water kH is 430ppm mg/L My well water is 370ppm mg/L Calcium of my softened water is <20 (very low) I had done an experiment with peat. I soaked some in a pail for a 3 days. Starting pH is 8.5 of course. At the end, it went down to 8.2 So it does work. However, if I have a tank that has been lowered to 8.2 by whatever (peat, driftwood), I would have to be very careful with water changes right? No? Anyway. So there ya have it. I would like to meet Mr. Roberts. Would like to meet the guy who raised my fishies. As for the Zebras, I hope they don't mind my wonky water. But I thought they would like the softened water over my well water no? Also have 3 x 150 Watt heaters in that tub. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smokey Posted September 29, 2004 Report Share Posted September 29, 2004 I have been using peat conditioned water exculsivly for all my discus. Blackwater. I have a dedicated peat fiilter and I am designing an inexpensive model for the average person to use. Easy to build with material from any hardware store shelf. Depending on the final water numbers; pH / KH - I want; a gallon of peat moss will condition an incrediable amount of water ... with no waste water [ like my R/O unit]. the model I am building holds two gallons of peat moss and will condition in excess of 700 liters of water to KH@ 65 PPM. Currently the KH I am using for the adult discus. Raw TAP WATER IS pH=7.8 GH=220 ppm KH= 189 ppm The tannins and humic acid from the moss are very benifical for S.A. species. Smokey Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tc51 Posted September 29, 2004 Report Share Posted September 29, 2004 Just had to say, thanks for the interesting info,Smokey, please post when the filter you are designing is compleat. Thanks again to both for the informative post. Tom. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wandj Posted November 12, 2004 Report Share Posted November 12, 2004 Hey! How can I read the TFM and ACE articles about Mr. Roberts breeding methods/success? Where are they? I searched the net and no luck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smokey Posted November 13, 2004 Report Share Posted November 13, 2004 (edited) wandj; Bob R.'s article regaurding the breeding of the L-46, zebra . I would suggest you contact A.C.E. [Aquarium Club Edmonton]. Bob wrote an excellant article, and it was published in their monthly publication. They may have a copy of the article, in their libary. TFH published the article. January 1995. You could try their site. Smokey Edited November 13, 2004 by Smokey Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smokey Posted November 13, 2004 Report Share Posted November 13, 2004 wandj, you have a pm. Smokey Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wandj Posted November 13, 2004 Report Share Posted November 13, 2004 Hey! Thank you Smokey! Boy you guys, do I ever feel stupid. I didn't know what ACE meant. I typed it in Yahoo! and I got some "african cichlids" website, so here I thought the article was on a cichlid website. And I couldn't find it anyway. And get this...I just joined the real ACE (aquarium club of edmonton) just last month! See how I feel stupid? I am a club member and I didn't know what ACE meant. So I guess I can ask Gabriel. He is the librarian. These abbreviations mess me up! I searched for the article on the net through TFM (Tropical fish mag right!) and it looks like they don't have articles avail to see. So I will email Gabriel. Thanks you guys. I'm not the smartest tool in the shed, so it's nice when people help out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wandj Posted November 13, 2004 Report Share Posted November 13, 2004 Opps. he he I mean "I'm not the SHARPEST tool in the shed". Sigh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smokey Posted November 16, 2004 Report Share Posted November 16, 2004 For any members who may be interested: Bob Roberts _ Hypancistrus zebra, L-46. Published in Aqua Babble, November, 1996; pages - 18 & 19. Aqua-Babble is the offical publicatiion of the Aquarium Club of Edmonton. Tropical Fish Hobbyist; 1995, January issue. published Mr. Roberts success; a very good article. Bob was creditted with being the first person to have successfully bred the Hypancistrus zebra, L-46. Quite an accomplishment. :thumbs: Smokey Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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