Sump Designs, Using Canister Filter As The Return Pump

[kindasleepy]

Hey guys,

I'm getting my tank for my reef system today and am still working out how best to do a small sump in the stand. I had an idea last night and want to run it by you guys for troubleshooting I suppose.

So the tank is a 35 gallon fluval studio. It's plumbed on the bottom and comes with a fluval 305, heater, T5s and other bits and bobs. The holes in the bottom are in the left back corner right next to each other. I was thinking of finding appropriate piping to increase the height of both of the fittings since they are both designed to filter and return at the bottom of the tank. If I increase the height to the water surface I can make one tube the down-pipe into the sump and the other a return which would double as a powerhead and adjust it so it moves water around the tank not just in the corner (because the two pipes are right next to each other). I'm still working on the actual plumbing plan (I am not a plumber), how to reduce noise from the water flowing down etc. I had an idea last night though. Can I use the fluval 305 as the return pump? The water would flow into the sump, pass through the various baffles (still deciding what I want to do there as well) then be pumped through the filter then up to the tank.

What do you guys think? Now, one thing I'm still debating in my head is the need for mechanical filtration. I know a lot of you guys suggest not using foam/poly because nitrates build up too rapidly. A) would the nitrates really build up THAT quickly that it merits not having mechanical filtration? B ) would I be able to use poly or something similar early in the sump, then none in the filter? It would be easier to change (no taking apart the filter). I guess I've just been doing fresh tanks too long, I'm having a really hard time of wrapping my head around the concept of no mechanical filtration, just lots of bio and some chemical.

Ok, couple more questions. How would I best establish and maintain a large copepod population? Everyone keeps telling me there's no way I could do a mandarin dragonet in such a small tank because of the lack of this type of critter. Any of you guys have success? Would mechanical filtration negatively affect this population?

Any suggestions or ideas?

Edited June 11, 2012 by kindasleepy

[jvision]

The canister needs the height of the tank to function properly... I do not believe it will work as a return.

The main reason that people don't want anything that will produce more nitrates is because the easiest way to remove nitrates is with WCs, and WCs with SW is expensive! Could you imagine what changing 10-15gal of water every week would cost?! If your pockets are deep, then go for it; but, why not save those $$ and buy some more nice fish or corals?

If you`re going to run a sump, you can do mechanical filtration (filter socks, floss, sponge, whatever) and just replace/rinse it every few days - week.

I'm going to guess that your plumbing is 3/4", and you will want to extend them to the height you want the water to be. I would also recommend adding a 1-1.5" sleeve that is slotted for the top 2-3" to keep any snails from clogging your return.

[kindasleepy]

Do you mean that the canister won't be powerful enough to return to the top of the water level? Also, do nitrates build up faster in SW because of larger bio-loads than FW?

Edited June 11, 2012 by kindasleepy

[Sprucegruve]

i dont know much about salt water,but from the sounds of it,your nitrates build at a normal rate but because salt keepers avoid changing water because of cost of marine salt,the nitrates need to be removed mechanically(skimmer,or something else)

that is my general knowledge of SW keeping.

[jcgd]

SW tanks are generally lightly stocked. The cost is too great to push limits.

The cannister relies on a syphon to draw the water into it, and then it pumps it back up. Use a standard pump on the sump. They push much more water anyway. Most SW tanks rely on live rock for biological filtration. A filter sock rinsed every few days on the drain is good for mechanical as sponges, etc., tend to become nitrate factories once again. A skimmer is highly recommended and is what generally takes up most of the sump.

I never run mechanical filtration in any tanks, unless it's the couple days following a major disruption and I want to trap debris that aren't normally floating around. Water movement will keep the water clear.

[kindasleepy]

Thanks for the info about the canister. I'm still very confused as to why the lack of mechanical filtration. Nitrates still develop no matter whether it's in the filter media or the substrate, why not use media to easily remove it? People mention the cost of water changes in SW but wouldn't collecting and removing wastes via a filter (as long as you maintain it ofcourse) be better than not? Sorry guys, I just really need a good explanation of the science behind it.

[jvision]

A lightly stocked tank will not produce a lot of nitrates, and Live Rock (and/or a deep sand bed) will help take care of what would be produced thru denitrification. The reason a lot of the SW people say sponge/floss is a nitrate factory is that it's hard to rinse those out often enough to keep them from producing excess nitrates. That all being said, nitrates are only a problem if you're wanting to go with a reef tank; most SW fish can handle nitrates 20ppm or a bit more (I've seen some hardy inverts/corals in some relatively poor quality water, too!)