neat octopus story and video

[Goldfish Girl]

thought i'd start this here instead of hijack the thread in the buy/sell.

I don't think these animals should be in tanks... anyones. I'm sure a bunch of people will roll their eyes at this, but I think (after keeping this one in the shop for the last couple of months) that octopi are FAR too developed psychologically and emotionally to be kept in home aquaria. Unless you are going to devote 23 hours a day to entertaining it, you are just wasting its life. Personally, I would rather see chimps used for cosmetic testing than see another octopi kept.

agreed. (maybe not about the chimps part though) wish we had that type of responsible store in edmonton. have to check out your store next time i'm in calgary.

thats not saying anything against people who keep them though. they are cool. no one can deny that. some people keep octopus, some people hybrids. don't agree with it but, what are you gonna do. (please do not start the hybrid debate for the gazilionth time in this topic. start your own. this is about octopi.)

on to the octopus:

there was a story in the paper a while ago, can't remember which public aquarium it was at, but they were draining a tank with an octopi in it and as soon as the water level went lower then her ledge, she started freaking out and trying to climb up the wall. no one could figure out why so they just assumed it was the low water level she wasn't used to. the octopi then started to blow water up onto the ledge. that was when they decided to look if there was anything on it. it turns out there were eggs and she was trying to keep them wet. needless to say they filled the tank back up. just shows how smart these things really are.

anyone watch 'Ocean's Deadliest' with Steve Irwin? they had bluerings on there. (anyone watch it and feel the need to buy a stonefish after? lol. i did.)

something neat at the seattle aquarium about octopus. shows how evolved they really are. esspecially for something that doesn't even have a backbone. i wouldn't beleive it if they didn't have this video.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n-3_UPnCtLg

[little sea]

Yeah, sorry about the jack, Darcy.

Risking extreme anthropomorhpism, I can see this animal think. It calculates and gauges its environment constantly. It communicates and feels. The range of expression it can convey is absolutly astounding (writing this had better not be making people want one). I can't imagine how a brain can articulate eight legs with that kind of dexterity at once. I think a new term for grace should be created for this display of elegance.

I think that LFS at times need to look past whether they can make money on an animal or not to whether they should or not. I know that comes up all the time with big fish, hybrids, overcrowding and everything else, but octopi are different. With octopi you are seriously keeping something smarter than yourself. Were it not for their lifespan, they would be us as dominant on this planet. Stores and aquarists need an honest answer as to why they should be in captivity that's better than "cause its cool". This problem, like many, is compounded by the fact that they are cheap.

Ancient cults used to worship them as gods. After all the lunches I've had with the one here, I can see why.

*****Again, not a slam to people that have/sell/want one. Just my lowly, humble thoughts.*****

Edited January 24, 2007 by little sea

[rudy]

I agree with what is said here.....but I want to tell a story about my day.

I went downstairs and fed my octopus like I alays do then went to the gym and went to work. I went to a meeting, stopped at Elite and then went out for lunch with a client. We went to Misai Japanese and ate sushi. I ordered some tuna, some salmon and various other things, but also an octopus. I did not feel bad as I ate the bastard as I knew the one in my tank was far luckier than the one on my plate. I paid $5 for the one on my plate, $30 for the one in my tank. Yet again capitalism rules. Yet they taste probably the same.

I am a big believer that many fish should be kept in the wild and not kept in aquariums. Having said that they are for the most part available. Come to my house and probably most of the animals here are not supposed to be here, but they are. For the record I am not a responsible fish keeper. I take care of them probably better than most, I care for them, more than definately most, yet I would like them all at my house.

The purpose of a board like this is to educate people and thus changing the way people view what they should or should not get. Whether they do...is entirely up to them. Octopus will always be available. So will red tail cats. The point that I always remember is the Blue Ring octopus at Big Als Calgary for $350 for a 6 gallon eclipse and an animal that....will kill you. Not just may if you are allergic, will. It was fiscally responsilbe for Big Als to sell it..it was morally responsible for me to tell everybody I ever knew not to buy it. Responsible in my view is Denis from Golds freezing two BLue rings when he got them in. I always respected him for that. I know it killed him to kill these beautiful animals, but he would not sell them and that is responsible in my view. The fact that Oceans once took a red tail cat on trade for his buddy to ....eat it. Some may think that is whacked. I say how cool is that?

As far Coby and his octo. I see what he means Some may say an 24 gallon jbj cube is o.k. I know and he knows it is not. It is his perceived responsiblity to not order them for "the fear that they may end up in some guys tank that has absolutely no idea what he has and it will die". Very cool mentality. He will sacrifice his business and potentially some customers because he is...get this...worried about the animal and where it goes. :bow:

Edited January 24, 2007 by rudy

[Kevin]

Great, respectful and informative posts.

Thank you!

[Goldfish Girl]

great points rudy.

as far as the octopus goes i think there are the few and far between fish keepers like you who will keep an octopus how it should be kept, in an environment that it will thrive. it is the same with alot of things. i just think its great that someone won't bring them in because of people who will buy it because its "cool" throw it into their saltwater tank at home because they think it will be "fine" and have it crawl out dry up and them wonder why it didn't live. its the same with oscars and red tail cats. people buy the fish, throw it in their 10 gallon when they first get it and then wonder why it doesn't seem happy. i've worked at two different pet stores over the past five years and even though the store policy, esspecially at one store, was to always sell it. i don't care, fire me. its not worth a fish going to an environment where it will eventually die because it is not being looked after. i don't care if that means an octopus in a six gallon, or someone putting a goldfish in a bowl and not changing the water for a year. i do understand that people on this site are generally well educated and if they aren't want to learn about how to do things better. unfortunately, i can speak from experience that this isn't the general public's point of veiw. so i guess its not so much the octopus i don't agree with, its irresponsible fish keeping and octopus seem to be a prime target for that.

wish i was in the hobby when the blue ring was in calgary. have a feeling that would have caused quite the stir up...