Tanker Posted October 14, 2005 Report Share Posted October 14, 2005 If you have ever wondered if it's 'worth' setting up a CO2 system, either a 'pro' set up with a pressure bottle or a DIY or store bought intank solution... check this out. I took pictures of my tank once I got my lights/hood on last week. this is October 2. There is 84 watts of light (2x 24W 10,000k and 2x 18W 6,500k) over the tank, so about 1.5 watts per gallon, so nothing special. I fertilize with Flourish Tabs. No big secret there, either. I have a single Nutrafin CO2 kit, designed for a 20 gallon tank running, and WOW! THAT is the trick... Here is the tank 12 days later. mind you the water level is 1 inch below the lip (slight trickle down the back forces this... found that when I filled it up for the before picture ). The sword has grown a full 3 inches in that time. That's 1/4 a day, each and every day. I had been considering adding a second kit to the tank, or doing a true 'DIY' to add some more CO2 (I don't have a kit to test the CO2 level) but after seeing the real deal... I don't think I need to! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
electronic_brick Posted October 14, 2005 Report Share Posted October 14, 2005 Looks good! I hope my tank takes off like that! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ronrca Posted October 14, 2005 Report Share Posted October 14, 2005 Imo, if your plants are doing well, why change it. Sometimes if you change even 1 parameter, you may be looking at trouble. Give it another couple of weeks and see how it looks also. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milan Posted October 14, 2005 Report Share Posted October 14, 2005 (edited) Looks beautiful. Just wait till Sagittaria grows into a carpet. Have you measured the KH and pH? Just curious how that Nutrafin ladder diffuser is performing. In my opinion, with 1.5w/gal and some CO2, this should not be an issue. Edited October 14, 2005 by Milan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blue Ram Posted October 14, 2005 Report Share Posted October 14, 2005 I have a power compact lighting system over my 35 gal (96 watts or 2.75 w/gal). I have a single Nutrafin CO2 system running as well. Even though I think this system is a pain in the "a", I regularly have to remove plants from the tank to make room for the rainbowfish to swim! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tanker Posted October 14, 2005 Author Report Share Posted October 14, 2005 I had not tested the KH previously, but my pH has gone from 7.6 to 7.4... hardly even worth mentioning, in the grand scheme. Of course, with the hardness of Edmonton tap water... I didn't expect to see the wild swings in pH reported in some other areas. That ladder had my butt kicked for the first two weeks it ran... to the point I had a glass sight level in the tank trying to get it perfectly vertical. Someone here mentioned that it took some time for it to actually 'work' (get's coated with tank crap and the bubbles stop sticking) and that's exactly what happened. By the time the bubbles reach the top of the ladder, they are just specks after starting out at a good 1/4 inch or so. If you look at the picture carefully, you'll note the Rena's spraybar is mounted right in front of the ladder, and blows across it (about 2 inches in front). This way I don't end up with one side of the tank saturated with CO2 and the other side with a lower level. I have created a current across the whole tank as the spray bar shoots completely horizontally. I used to have it spray up at a 45 degree angle, which caused a really pretty ripple on the water's surface, but I found the lower reaches of the tank were not getting the water flow. Now the swords are 'flowing' and even the carpet plants (Echinodorus tenellus, 'Pygmy Chain Sword', for those who like that sort of info) have some movement to them and are doing much better. The java ferns were just added, and I have noticed growth from them in the past week that they have been in there. When I got them from the last ACE auction in May, the leaves were a darker green and over the months have not really changed, and in the past week they have lightened considerably and now nearly every leaf has a new plant starting off on it's tip. Also worth mentioning is the price of admission. The Nutrafin kit ran me about $30 (on sale, normally about $60) and comes with "3 months supply" of mixture for their fermentation pot. I doubted that this was going to actually last a month a pouch, and it doesn't. It runs for about 5 weeks! I was REALLY surprised by this but after running the first batch for 36 days, I finally noticed a slight reduction in production, so I replaced the mixture. The mixture is a little pouch of yeast (can't say what kind, tho) and a 'stabilizer' pouch (something to buffer/reduce the alcohol content, is my guess) which is added to about 1 cup of sugar and about 3-4 cups of water. The fermentation chamber has lines inside of it, no measuring required. When the container was opened up after the 36 days, there was a really slight smell of bread... and not the 'something died in here' smell I was expecting. Certainly nothing at all compared to even the mildest microworm culture. Absolutely no complaints at all on this 'underpowered' system, and I'll post again in a month to update on the progress. I'll be picking up some more plants at the auction (well... depends on what people bring, I suppose) I want to fill in the area behind the wood pile and will be looking for something sword-like, but different. Maybe something in a red... hmmm... I'm going to pick up a 'plant keeper's' test kit this weekend so then I'll know if it's fluke or talent Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milan Posted October 15, 2005 Report Share Posted October 15, 2005 Like I said, with your lights, some CO2 is more than enough ... BTW, what's the "plant keeper's" test kit? Never heard of such ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tanker Posted October 15, 2005 Author Report Share Posted October 15, 2005 That's just what I call the 'other' tests that a plant keeper needs, as opposed to the tests most common fish keepers have. Phosporus, CO2, Iron... I only have the standard ammonia, nitr*tes, pH, etc. I decided to hold out and see if there would be a master kit offered up at the auction, before I spend money at a retail... *hint*hint* I'm looking for a Master Kit. lol... can someone sell one, please? Oh... and I was going to start a thread asking what tests to buy... but I found the info (where else?) in a Pinned Topic! This place is SO handy! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milan Posted October 15, 2005 Report Share Posted October 15, 2005 In my opinion, NO3 and PO4 tests would suffice. Some fertilization programs don't call for testing at all (i.e. Estimative Index), but I consider tests being similar to instrumentation in your car. You can drive without them successfully, but one day it may stop, and if it does, you won't know why. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jvision Posted October 15, 2005 Report Share Posted October 15, 2005 What I've done, instead of heading back to the LFS to pick up some more of the Nutrafin packets, I go to the grocery store and pick up some brewers yeast and bulk Baking Soda (guess what the "Stabilizer" is). I love the ladder diffuser - I even use one on my pressurized system. And the brew chamber Nutrafin supplies is better than any pop bottle I've ever used! For your light level, it seems like the CO2 is all you need. WCs will help keep nutrient levels high enough. But, if you plan on upping your light, you'll probably need to suppliment with other nutrients (KNO3, K2PO4, traces). If you're looking for some nice red plants, PM me. I can't make the auction this weekend (sister's getting married), but I've got some nice Ozelot swords and Red Tiger Lotus that should do great in your tank. Looking good!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milan Posted October 16, 2005 Report Share Posted October 16, 2005 Tanker, what ferts are you using, if any? Specifically, macros and traces ... And again about tests, you don't need to buy CO2 and Fe tests, unless you want to go on a spending spree ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Molino Posted October 16, 2005 Report Share Posted October 16, 2005 instead of heading back to the LFS to pick up some more of the Nutrafin packets, I go to the grocery store and pick up some brewers yeast and bulk Baking Soda (guess what the "Stabilizer" is) I agree with Jason, once you run out of the packets save yourself some money and to to your grocery store. I use only yeast and sugar for my mixture and have had no problems. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tanker Posted October 16, 2005 Author Report Share Posted October 16, 2005 Jvision, you've got mail! As for ferts I use the Flourish Tabs as I have NO idea what I am doing and hey... the package says they'd work fine . I also like the idea of spending $12 every three months and not having to mix my own or meddle with several different products. I just remembered, I also have the "fern" root sticks in there... one under each of the big swords. I have a nitrate test I like so all I need is phosphate? That should be easy enough to find, then. I am still a REALLY big plant n00b, but I am willing to learn, as long as it's not too complicated. I have several things on the go and my brain and time constraints simply cannot handle too much attention be diverted to the plants, right now. I have got great growth in my tanks... and if I can just 'maintain' it for a couple months without killing everything, I'll be thrilled. Oh, how do you "split" swords? The three big bunchs in the back are getting too big, and I don't want to just prune them down as that's killing good plant... I'd rather split them down into more plants so I can add some to my 20 gallon. Do you just cut down the middle so that some roots stay with each half, or? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milan Posted October 16, 2005 Report Share Posted October 16, 2005 (edited) As for ferts I use the Flourish Tabs as I have NO idea what I am doing and hey... the package says they'd work fine . I also like the idea of spending $12 every three months and not having to mix my own or meddle with several different products. I just remembered, I also have the "fern" root sticks in there... one under each of the big swords. Flourish Tabs are just traces, and the root sticks are strong NPK ferts (your swords will love them), so you are OK if you want to stick with commercial way. I have a nitrate test I like so all I need is phosphate? That's right, but since your ferts are substrate based, you don't have control over them anyways, so why bother testing them. Just watch your plants for defficiencies, but I would doubt you will face it in your environment. Oh, how do you "split" swords? The three big bunchs in the back are getting too big, and I don't want to just prune them down as that's killing good plant... I'd rather split them down into more plants so I can add some to my 20 gallon. Do you just cut down the middle so that some roots stay with each half, or? I have not done it myself with rosete plants, but I would assume you split them at roots, once you have enough growth. Edited October 16, 2005 by Milan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jvision Posted October 17, 2005 Report Share Posted October 17, 2005 Oh, how do you "split" swords? The three big bunchs in the back are getting too big, and I don't want to just prune them down as that's killing good plant... I'd rather split them down into more plants so I can add some to my 20 gallon. Do you just cut down the middle so that some roots stay with each half, or? Splitting swords can be tricky.... if they're just one plant, then don't do it; however, if you can see more than one 'centre' - a place where leave originate - then you could just pull them apart. The roots will be tangled, but be gentle, it should come apart w/o much trouble. I've never seen a common sword flower, but, if you decide to up the light, it should send up a flower stalk. If you keep the flowers submerged, they'll grow into plantlets - it's how I propigate my Ozelot. HTH. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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