Community Tank: Compatibility

[Mighty Prawn]

So I set up my tank, and I am currently just hosting a party of Ghost shrimp, plants and driftwood. I got some rocks, and will be testing them with muric acid tomorrow to be sure they won't dissolve, and hopefully put them in.

Now here is my proposed fish list, could I get some comments on whether or not they would be safe or not for all the fish?

55 Gallon, planted, C02 system, going to try and keep the tank at approx 77 degrees.

Fish:

20 Ghost Shrimp (1-1.5") total 30 inches

2 Butterfly Loaches (3") total 6 inches

3 Orange Corydoras Catfish (3") total 9 inches

3 Yoyo Loaches (4") total 12 inches

3 Clown Loaches (6") total 18 inches

6 Kuhli Loaches (3") total 18 inches

1 Male Betta (2") total 2 inches

2 Male Swordtails 4 Female Swordtails (5") total 30 inches

2 Male Platies 4 Female Platies (2.5") total 15 inches

6 Rainbows (3.5") total 21 inches

3 African Dwarf Frogs (1.5") total 4.5 inches

3 Freshwater Clams (2") total 6 inches

6 Snails (3") total 18 inches (apple, rams, mystery, dunno yet)

So in total that would be 189.5 inches.

That's what I would like as my end result for my community tank.

I've heard of 2 kinds of ways to figure out how to decide how many fish you can have. 1 inch of fish per gallon, or divide the length by the width and divide by 12 to get the inches you can have.

So of course you'd go with the full grown size... However this seems like more of a "approximation" to me.

With the first method I'd have room for 55 inches worth of fish, the second method

I'd have 52.

So with 20 Ghost shrimp, I'd have 30 inches, assuming they are all females, females usually being 1.5" that'd be 30 inches right there. Now, I don't know if everyone here knows Ghost Shrimp, but they are tiny. Width and height would probably need to be a part of the equation I'd think. I may of course be wrong being a begginer...

Do you guys think that what I want is waaaayyy too many fish for a 55 gallon tank?

And if my tank is fine for that many fish, are all of those fish compatible?

I've tried my best to do research on compatibility, however whenever a site says compatible species, they never of course list every possible fish, and never show incompatible species. Moreover, I have found conflicting data from various books and websites. Thus seeking experience from the intelligent forum goers here :-)

Opinions/facts?

Thanks in advance.

-Hideo

[Magicide]

I'm fairly new to it but I know that the inch rule is by no means hard and fast. It's strongly dependent on the tank size, species, filtratration and how much care you put into maintaining the tank.

Don't quote me on this, but if you keep your water quality high enough to support invertebrates in the first place can you not put a fair number in since they aren't as territorial as many fish? As well, if you have the luck with snails I've seen others have you will be swarmed with them in time unless those Yoyo's can keep up with the spawning.

[pat]

A majority of your selection live in the bottom of the tank. Even if you can maintain the water quality, I am afraid it is getting a little too crowded in the bottom.

[Tanker]

I wouldn't put a male betta in there at all, unless it's a Imbellis or Plekat or whatever... just no fancy tails or you'll find yourself fishing out floaters more then you care to, especially with swords... he'll attack anything that even comes near him. My Imbellis flares at my female swords... I can just imagine how much fun a veil tail would have with a male sword...

As well, Platys and Swords cross breed... not suggested, generally. Oh, and try for three or four females to each male, then they'll 'pick' their own and the boys won't spar so much.

Oh, and a 5" sword is BIG in the sword-world... and would several years to grow to. Average for a year old fish is about 2 inches (tails don't count). Generally speaking again, once a sword, etc starts to breed, growth is slowed and sometimes stopped... so a several year old fish will look 'young' if it's been in co-ed accomodations

Oh, and one last bit from my admittedly short experiences is with the ADF's... they don't tend to like deep tanks from what I have seen. When you're only an inch long it takes a bloody long time to swim 18 inches, with currents in the tank, just to get some air.

After reading over your list again, I'm wondering just how you plan to fit the list (even with juvie fish, that's a LOT), plants AND swimming room into that tank? I have a 50 with 25 creatures and 6 plant types in it and it seems full to me...

Kudos for planning and ambition!

[Blue Ram]

I'll just comment on compatibility - the rainbows, cories, yoyos and a male betta will be fine. I have this setup in a 35 gal with no issues whatsoever. My betta is a male half moon. I do not have any long finned fish however in this tank. I personally think your proposed list is far too many. You do not need that many loaches in a tank that size and eventually you would have to move them to a bigger tank. Good luck. I know how hard it is to choose when you want one of everything!!

[jvision]

One more thing... Loaches + snails = 0 snails. May even hold true for your gohst shrim, too. :boxed:

[Mighty Prawn]

Thanks for all the replies! I've adjusted my list a bit, seeing as I seem to have too many fish.

20 Ghost Shrimp (1-1.5") total 30 inches

2 Butterfly Loaches (3") total 6 inches

3 Orange Corydoras Catfish (3") total 9 inches

6 Kuhli Loaches (3") total 18 inches

1 Male Betta (2") total 2 inches

2 Male Platies 4 Female Platies (2.5") total 15 inches

6 Rainbows (3.5") total 21 inches

2 Freshwater Clams (2") total 4 inches

3 Snails (3") total 9 inches (apple, rams, mystery, dunno yet)

The way I'll be doing it is adding 1 set at a time. If it seems to be getting crowded, I just won't get the next set.

Now I just wish I got a much bigger tank!

-Hideo

[Vallisneria]

2 Freshwater Clams (2") total 4 inches

I haven't heard good things about keeping freshwater clams. Seems that they are very hard to feed(because they are filter feeders) and usually die and end up polluting the tank(because they bury themselves in the gravel and you can't tell if they are dead). IF keeping these it would be best to try a clam only tank.

[Mighty Prawn]

I had that concern, too, but a man at Gold's Aquariums told me when they die their "beard" that holds on lets go and they float to the top.

-Hideo

[Murminator]

One more thing... Loaches + snails = 0 snails.  May even hold true for your gohst shrim, too.  :boxed:

I'll agree I had to get a loach before because my snails got out of hand and the 1st thing he ate was all the smaller shrimp he did leave the big big ones alone but you could never find big ones so I would buy a medium one and he would eat it. so I give up on them till I got rid of the loach.

[Toirtis]

OK, firstly, still far too many fish....you need to cut down by a good half or more or get a 100 gallon tank...its not as much about crowding as it is about bio-load and water parameters.

Secondly, 'butterfly loaches' (hillstream loaches), do poorly at temperatures above 74ºF and require current and highly-oxygenated water to thrive....in a typical tropical tank, their lifespan will be cut by about 90%.

By 'orange corydoras' do you mean the 'orange laser' corys? Corys do best in schools of 5+, so if you wish some, plan for that.

As far as rainbows go, there are dozens of species, some of which attain only 2" as adults, some which exceeed 8" each....do you know what species you want?

Which snail species you get is very important....the big apple snails and all ramshorns will decimate your plants (the big apples will also predate fish), mystery snails are plant and fish safe, as are Malayan trumpet/livebearing snails, with the latter being much smaller than the former, and more prolific.

Just out of curiousity, what sort of filtration are you running on this tank?

[Toirtis]

I had that concern, too, but a man at Gold's Aquariums told me when they die their "beard" that holds on lets go and they float to the top.

-Hideo

Nope....mostly these just decompose in place....and quickly....a 2"-3" snail can foul a tank in hours.

[Mighty Prawn]

Thanks so much for the fantastic advice... Though I am a bit dissapointed that I have to cut even more out of my tank. It's so hard to decide. At this point I'm now thinking I may just do a handful of kuhli's, corydoras and the rest all a livebearer of some sort.

Filter is an AquaClear Power Filter 70, which is apparently for 40-70 gallon tanks.

I have a bad feeling you're going to tell me it's crap. Since I'm a newbie, I'd most likely to be inclined to go out and buy a new one, hehe. Damn starter kit is nothing but trouble!

-Hideo

[jvision]

Those starter kits are generally OK. You should be good with what it comes with - unless you're doing plants.

The main thing is to start slow. Your latest list should be fine for your 33.

[Mighty Prawn]

Okay! So I updated my list once again, and hopefully this time it will be acceptable for my fish.

19 Ghost Shrimp (1-1.5")

6 Orange Corydoras Catfish (3")

6 Kuhli Loaches (3")

1 Male Betta (2")

8-10 Platies or 8-10 Rainbows (Celebes Rainbowfish I think) or a combination of both not exceeding 10-12

So I hope this would be acceptable. I changed it to 19 Ghost Shrimp cuz one of my shrimp has died.

Ideally I would like to have a few different rainbow species, but from my research seems like they often have temperature differences that wouldn't be acceptable. And my fav is the Celebes, so I figure, go with that!

How does it look now?

Should I be putting more of an emphasis on the space taken up by the ghost shrimp? They take up so little space and seem to produce hardly any waste at all.

-Hideo