A two part question

[DaveDude77]

Hello everyone,

I started cycling my tank 3 wks ago and for the past four days I've been getting low if not zero readings for ammonia & nitrites, and about 5 - 10 ppm for nitrates (using Hagen's Master Test Kit). Is it possible that my tank has cycled in 3 wks? I thought it would take 6 - 8 wks. I've got a 32G planted tank with 5 Long Fin Leopard Danios and 2 SAEs. I've been doing weekly water changes, and using something called "Step 2" from Pisces here in Calgary.

If you think the tank has cycled (don't worry I won't hold anyone to their word), what kind of fish work best with Leopard Danios? Although they're supposed to be schooling fish, these guys seem mostly territorial, although sometimes they'll group together. Some of my Danios have shredded fins do to fin nipping. Anyway, I was thinking 2 Discus, but will the Danios nip their fins too? Or maybe 2 Angels, but the fin nipping? Maybe 2 Gouramies (sp?) but I hear they're aggressive and I like my Danios. Cichlids are cool but they'll eat everyone, won't they? I won't be getting fish for a week or two but I'd love any suggestions until then.

Thanks all.

[Lana Bollers]

I do believe your tank has cycled.

As for the fish, that is entirely up to you.

Lana

[Drydock]

Hello everyone,

I started cycling my tank 3 wks ago and for the past four days I've been getting low if not zero readings for ammonia & nitrites, and about 5 - 10 ppm for nitrates (using Hagen's Master Test Kit). Is it possible that my tank has cycled in 3 wks? I thought it would take 6 - 8 wks. I've got a 32G planted tank with 5 Long Fin Leopard Danios and 2 SAEs. I've been doing weekly water changes, and using something called "Step 2" from Pisces here in Calgary.

If you think the tank has cycled (don't worry I won't hold anyone to their word), what kind of fish work best with Leopard Danios? Although they're supposed to be schooling fish, these guys seem mostly territorial, although sometimes they'll group together. Some of my Danios have shredded fins do to fin nipping. Anyway, I was thinking 2 Discus, but will the Danios nip their fins too? Or maybe 2 Angels, but the fin nipping? Maybe 2 Gouramies (sp?) but I hear they're aggressive and I like my Danios. Cichlids are cool but they'll eat everyone, won't they? I won't be getting fish for a week or two but I'd love any suggestions until then.

Thanks all.

If you have live plants, they consume some of the waste products from the fish as well. If you haven't lost any daino's you should be able to SLOWLY add fish. Your tank is an equilibrium - it will balance the ability to deal with waste with what you put into it (within reason) If you suddenly add a bunch of fish and increase your bio-load, your tank will be off-balance again.

What you are doing in cycling a tank is starting from an unbalanced tank (no bacteria or ability to process fish waste) and building up those resources so that you can add a larger bio-load (fish). When people say that their tank is cycled, what has happened is that you have enough bacteria to deal with the waste load from the fish. When you add new fish, you add to that side of the equation, so you have to do it slowly so that the other side can catch up.

As far as what to add... probably some catfish first... corydoras? I don't know if Discus and SAE will be a good idea. Discus are slow and have a significant slime coat that sometimes are a target by other fish. Just ask specifically about that before you spend $$ on Discus.

You should also look at what temperatures your fish like. - Discuss need to be fairly warm (82 ish?) and some other fish and plants can't handle that.

Dainos are a fairly fast fish and you may be able to use them as a dither fish in an African tank or with gouramies (depends which ones) I wouldn't rule out either of those yet. Or you could always get a nice 10G daino tank... :thumbs: Aquariums are like lays potato chips - bet you cant have just one...

[Fish_Frenzy]

That tank size isn't suitable for Discus as it is too small. Also, Discus need a minimum temp of 84F, way too warm for Danios. I would start with a few Bronze Cories or some of the tougher, cooler water Cories. Start with a minimum of 3-5 as they like their own company.

From that point you could gradually add anything from Platies, Swordtails, Dwarf Gourami or even an Angel. Research different sites to find out what is compatible temperature wise and also compatibility wise. Maybe even focus on a species tank with all the different strains of Danios...there are many possibilities.

Discus are more of a specialty fish and when considering Discus, the main focus of the tank should be Discus and catering to their specific needs.

Just thought I would throw out a few ideas for your consideration. :smokey:

Tammy

[DaveDude77]

As always, thanks for the quick replies.

Lana: I know it's totally up to me, but from what I've learned is some fish don't get along too well with others. So that's my question

Drydock: I do understand what's going on with the N. cycle, I'm just surprised that I've built up the bacteria that quickly. Probably because my bio-load isn't too big to start off with, right? Also, I've learned that you shouldn't add too many fish at once so that's why I was looking into just two fish. To be honest, I think I may stop there. Use the Danios as some back ground and have a couple of profile fish.

As for asking about Discus, I'm here doing that. I honestly don't have much faith in the people at the LFS. I've had discussions with them regarding cycling and they seem a little confused about the process. Unless everyone else is wrong and I can't see that being the case. Also, I'm sure they'll be happy to sell me a Discus or two, it won't be their problem after that. OK, enough complaining.

So Discus and SAEs don't mix. Too bad, I love the colours on Discus fish. What do you mean by dither fish? And any suggestions as to what type of Gouramies work with Danios & SAEs?

And as for the Lays comment. I know what you mean. I sure do feel the MTS setting in, and going around to sites like Kijiji sure doesn't help the issue. There are some sweet deals in there on tanks.

[jvision]

Most Gouramis that are for sale at the stores are at a size that won't bother your danios, and should be good tankmates for a couple years at least. Opaline, Spotted and Gold are all the same species and should be fine. The Dwarf varieties should also do well. Avoid the pink/kissing gouramis - they're the meanest from what I've seen and heard.

Barbs would be a good fish - there are dozens of varieties, and most will do fine with danios.

Adding a larger fish, like an angel may keep your danios together - schooling behavior is normal in the wild b/c it keeps them safer from predators. Tho the angels will likely not eat your danios, a medium sized pair could be enough to keep the danios together.

Your tank likely cycled so fast because of the plants. Are they growing? If so, they're using a lot of the ammonia/nitritre, so the bacteria don't need to be as quick to grow.

[DaveDude77]

Thanks jvision. So you think Angels would be fine, eh? Cooool, I just may try that. I wanted a profile fish in my tank. I find it funny that the kissing gouramies are aggresive. I guess with all that kissing going on and no nookie makes them all up tight. :rofl:

Yes my plants are growing like weeds. I'm actually going to get a CO2 system as well. Mostly to help bring down the pH in the water. I don't know about anyone else, but my tap water is quite alkaline. About 8 - 8.2. Anyway, with the CO2, and some ferts, these plants will be huge in no time. Yahoo!!

[firestorm]

I am not sure how large your tank is, but if it's at least a 30 gallon you could go with 1 angel. I have found due to the conspecific agression in angels, it is best to keep them as a single, or in groups of 3 or more. 2 is just heading for disaster and one being killed by the other. Also with angels the thing you have to watch out for is not buying any species of fish that will stay small enough to fit in their mouths, as they will eat anyone that fits in them. SAE's are pretty good to have, usually only growing to about 4", but are not compatible with all fish. I would try to get at least a couple more danios, then try another species of fish with them. Cories would do great as bottom feeders, as would certain species of shrimp (like ghost shrimp). You could even try something like bolivian rams, but you will need to keep the temp at least about 78-80 for them, which probably don't make them perfect mates with cooler water species like danios, but they might work.

With CO2 you will want to make sure it is not bringing the pH down then up again too much, since large fluctuations in pH will cause problems for your fish. Driftwood and using peat in the filter are great ways to help naturally bring down pH.

I agree with discus, they will not be suitable for what you have. Besides that they are actually schooling fish so they do prefer to be kept in groups. Angels and discus are both cichlid species.

[DaveDude77]

Thanks everyone for the suggestions. I ended up picking up a marble anglefish and a male and female dwarf gourami. They're getting along great with the danios and the flying foxes.

[firestorm]

Great :thumbs: The danios will probably be too quick for angels to even consider eating lol.

[DaveDude77]

This is true that the Danios are too quick, but the Angelfish is only about 1.5" anyway so there isn't much of a threat there, is there? I hoping that by the time the Angelfish gets bigger I'll have a real nice big tank and I can get a couple more. Then I may try my hand at breeding. It sounds like people are having fun with it.

[clockwork]

This is true that the Danios are too quick, but the Angelfish is only about 1.5" anyway so there isn't much of a threat there, is there? I hoping that by the time the Angelfish gets bigger I'll have a real nice big tank and I can get a couple more. Then I may try my hand at breeding. It sounds like people are having fun with it.

good luck with adding new angels to hang out with your old one.

i did this after only a few months (the big bad boy wasn't even fully grown) and he relentlessly attacked the other angels that were only slightly smaller than he. needless to say he was quickly separated from the crew before any more damage was sustained. angels are socially complex and often don't play well with others, even if you have a big tank and say 5 or 6 of them (like i did). if you want to breed, get a breeding pair from someone that has one, otherwise you might end up having to split up your school of angels into different tanks or even sell the ones that aren't procreating if you don't have room.

anyways, how about some pics of your tank? sounds like a nice set up

[DaveDude77]

I've posted some links to my picks on another topic. My first planted 32G tank

Well that's a bummer about the angels. Geez, there sure are a lot of fish that don't get along with others when they get older, eh?

[firestorm]

I personally think it depends on the size of tank you will be putting more angels into after, how big the new angels are, and how many you put in. If you only add an extra 1 or 2 I can see them getting thrashed by the other one. But if you were to spread out the aggression a little more by putting in 4-5 more, I really don't think the one angel will be able to keep up on who it is going to pick on. From experience I have found angels to do better as a single, or in groups of 4 or more. If you have 2 there will always be the one that gets picked on by the more dominant one (unless it is a breeding pair), if you have 3, chances are 2 will pair off then you are stuck with 1 that gets beat up by the other 2. I also think it depends on the type of angel as well. I have had a couple white angels in the past, which were absolutely terrible and aggressive. My black angels however seem to be a little less aggressive.

I would not however have a larger group of angels unless the tank is a minimum size of 75 gallons.

Haha yeah angels are certainly no angels, they are anything but. I think your tank looks good