Angelfish Fry (Update)

[Ghostface]

Hello community,

Since this is my first spawn, I'm going to keep a log on how things are going.

So, starting from the beginning, my Angel pair spawned on May 18th. I moved the pot with eggs into a 10 gallon tank a few hours after. I used 5 gallon of water from the spawning tank.

I noticed the first wigglers 3 days later. On the 5th day most were either on the bottom or hanging onto the pot. On day 7 (today) they are free swimming...very cool! My guess is that there are

at least 200 lil guys swimming around. They usually hang out together in one of the corners of the tank, opposite the sponge filter, however when I watch them for a while, they start spreading out more (maybe they get scared?)

So, today I cleaned up as much of the gunk that has accumulated over the past 7 days. There was some blackish stuff that some of the fry and been clinging onto, and white eggs. I'm using airline tubing hooked onto a metal coathanger (saw this from a youtube clip, google Angelfish breeding documentary).

Its pretty hard not to suck those lil guys up because they still like to hang out at the bottom of the tank.

I have started my BBS (Baby Brine shrimp) hatchery, one started at 7am the other 7pm.

Do you guys rinse the BBS in fresh water? I'm using a straw to suck up the BBS.

Should I start doing my water changes today? I have about 9 gallons in the tank atm...do they need that much right now? Can I just take out 6 gallon, add 1 gallon of clean water (treated with prime), and keep adding 1 gallon per day until it is full again, then repeat the process?

Do I keep adding a few drops of Methylene blue after water changes?

I can't really see the egg sacs with the water being really blue, should I start feeding them 24h BBS tomorrow morning, 3x a day? I'm thinking first feed 7am - 5pm - 10pm.

To help with the cleaning after feeding, have you guys ever tried Snails or small pleco's to help out?

okay that is all for now, I'm sure I will have some more questions soon. I will try and post some pics of the fry soon, I'm not that good with the camera, but for now, here is a pic of my Pair.

Fry on Day 7 Free swimming

till next time,

Edited May 26, 2011 by Ghostface

[angel al]

If your fry are free swimming today they need to be fed today. 2 to 3 feedings a day is good. I space my feeding about 6 hours apart & I rinse the brine shrimp with fresh water before feeding. Small water changes daily are your best bet. Make sure you remove any left over food from the bottom of the tank from the previous feeding before each new feeding. You're on the right track with the airline & hanger wire for removing the waste & left over feed. I don't add methylene blue at this stage but that's a personal choice. Good luck you made it through the hardest part. I wouldn't add snails or plecos until the fry are pea size.

Edited May 26, 2011 by angel al

[Ghostface]

Ok, its day 8...the fry are doing great so far...I've had about 6 dead ones so far, and did my first 20% water change. I will do 10% (1 gallon) changes daily from now on.

I can't believe how full the fry get, looks like they are about to blow up after feeding.

My Angel's in the main tank are at it again, cleaning the pot and will probably spawn within the next couple days. Not exactly sure what I will do with them, I might go buy a 10 gallon and raise a 2nd spawn, just in case something goes wrong with my first spawn.

I'll add some pictures when they are 15 days old or something.

[angel al]

Have you thought about what you're going to do when these guys out grow the tank they're in 10 days or so from now?

Edited May 27, 2011 by angel al

[Ghostface]

I didn't realize that they grow out a 10 gallon that fast...what size tank would you recommend I throw them in?

[angel al]

Depending on how many there is, a 33 gallon minimum, a 40 gallon plus would be better though.

[nanmer]

I am watching this topic, I have a pair of angels that are getting ready to breed. It would be great if you could keep up with the updates and what you are doing for them. Great pictures!

[RebelThunder]

nice development for your brood Ghost. nice pics too.

just to interject, my pair laid eggs again and 90% turned white the next day. and today all the eggs are gone. maybe I don't know whats wrong with this too. I will let them pair still for the next 2 spawn and if it fails again I will change the male. I'm telling this cause I just wanted to ask if this kind of stuff happened to your pair before you got successful in getting fry. thanks

[Ghostface]

Alright as promised, here is my Day 15 update!

Everything has been going really well, I have only lost about 3-4 more frysince last update, they were tiny and had obviously not been eating. Otherwise,all the others are growing like crazy.

My daily process this far has been;

Feeding

7:30am (before work)

4:30pm (after work) clean up left over's 45mins later

10:30 (before bed) 20% Water change, clean up left over's. 45mins later

I use an Eyedropper to feed the fry. After the BBS have collected at the bottomof my glass bowl, I suck up 0.5ml (Days 8-11) or 1 ml (Days 12-15).

This has been working great so far. On day 8 I fed them about 1ml which was waytoo much, so you'll have to experiment yourself to see how much they eat.

Water Changes

20% change (2 gallons) after last feeding around 11:15pm. I conditionmy water with Prime 0.2ml using eyedropper.

Now, I've been reading a lot of posts in regards to water changes (on this andother sites) and everyone seems to be doing it differently. Some say

you should do 10% water change after every feeding, some say massive waterchanges of about 70-80% is the way to go. Some say 50% is a good number.

Anyways, I don't have the time to feed, wait 45mins and do a water change everyfeeding. The 20% water changes every night before bed has been working

great for me thus far, and I have hardly lost any fry. I do keep the tank veryclean.

I think once the fry are getting bigger, and they start producing more wasteetc I will start to do 50% water changes, but for now I don't feel it is necessary.

I also plan on adding plants to help with the water quality (I'm thinking afterDay 30-40.)

Water changes and clean up for the first few days were more challenging, as thefry are so small and uncoordinated. Now, they move out of the way and huddle upin a corner when I do my cleaning and water changes, which is nice, only takesabout 5-10mins to do it all.

Baby Brine Shrimp

I only used about half a teaspoon of eggs at the start (days 8-11),which lasted me for 3 feedings plus some.

I ran 2 batches at a time, First batch at 7:30 AM and second at 4:30pm. Nowthat they are bigger, I am just doing 1 batch of

1 teaspoon. I use a coffee filter to rinse off the BBS with tap water, thenplace them into a glass bowl and throw them in the fridge after my firstfeeding.

They will stay alive in the fridge for 1-2 days. I make a fresh batch every 24hours, so the leftovers I toss into a mini ice cube tray and freeze them

as treats for my other fish.

Well, I have to say, it's been a joy watching these guys grow in this shortamount of time. They have pretty much tripled in size and have even started torecognize me when I get close to the tank.

I can see they're lil eyes looking and checking me out. They don't have anycolors yet, but I see a shimmer as they turn, I can make out tiny fins on thesides and starting on the top. It's pretty cool

I think that's all I have for now, I may read over it in a while and add some stuff,or fix mistakes. I took a few more pictures of the lil guys, here they are.

I should also add, I am on the lookout for a 33 gallon + tank to move theseguys into, would be nice if it came with a heater, filter, air pump. If youfind a good deal for me, let me know muchappreciated,

till next time,

Cheers,

PS: The pictures only show about half of the fry, I'll try and get a picture ofthem all next time, but they get scared and scatter anytime I try and take apicture.

Day 12

Day 15

[Ghostface]

nice development for your brood Ghost. nice pics too.

just to interject, my pair laid eggs again and 90% turned white the next day. and today all the eggs are gone. maybe I don't know whats wrong with this too. I will let them pair still for the next 2 spawn and if it fails again I will change the male. I'm telling this cause I just wanted to ask if this kind of stuff happened to your pair before you got successful in getting fry. thanks

My pair usually ate the eggs before I had a chance to remove them the first 2x (although I didn't care to pull them back then). How many times have they spawned for you? And how old is the pair? Are you sure that you have a Male/Female and not 2 females?

If that was they're first spawn, I would let them try at least 2 more times. If anything, you could just give it a try and pull the eggs and use Methylene Blue and see what happens to the eggs. If you have a spare 20+ gallon tank, you could try and remove them from the main tank when you notice spawning behaviour, toss a blanket over top of the tank and let them have as much peace as possible.

It just takes time, hopefully they will get it next try good luck

[RebelThunder]

thanks for the reply Ghost. its their second attempt. I thought its gonna work this time cause the male is so defensive even when I go near and check them he will bump the aquarium and aggressive towards me. |I will give them 2 more tries. by the way where can you buy methylene blue in edmonton? are they the same as the medicine used for anti-ick? thanks

[angel al]

Methylene Blue is different than the ick formulas. If you cant find any in Edmonton you can use 3% hydrogen peroxide, 1ml per gallon every 12hrs for a day & a half after the eggs are layed. You can buy it at Walmart & it's cheap & effective. It won't color the water either. Just don't use it if there are shrimp in the tank.

[RebelThunder]

thanks. I will try there too.

[Ghostface]

Hello again,

Okay, everything has been going well so far. I have moved them into a 45 Gallon tank now, which they seem to be enjoying.

Since my last post, I have probably lost another 10-12 fry, not sure exactly why, but my guess is that I overfeed them a few times. They looked

very healthy, but I noticed 3-4 fry dead after feeding them. This happened 2 days in a row, so I scaled back on the amout of BBS I would

squirt in. Generally, 1 tsp of hatched BBS, would last me for 2 feedings. I would feed about 1/4, wait to see how full the bellies get, then feed another 1/4.

I haven't had any deaths in the past 5 days so everything seems to be going well. I am doing 30% water changes daily after last feeding.

I took a few more pictures, they are camera shy and very quick, so not the best quality. I also uploaded some videos of my spawning Pairs, as well as feeding the fry.

23 Days old

24 Days old

26 Days old

Edited June 16, 2011 by Ghostface

[angel al]

You are probably losing fry after your brine shrimp culture is older than 36 hrs. I don't use a culture after that because I ran into a similar problem. Your fry look good.