Milan Posted December 20, 2005 Report Share Posted December 20, 2005 (edited) Couple of days ago I found a Hagen ladder diffuser among some forgotten gadgets in my garage, so I decided to test it with a newly acquired pressurized system. I was very pleased with the performance. In my 29g I was able to reach 78 ppm of CO2 at the bubbling rate of 90 bbls/min. No kidding, all fish at the surface gasping for air. Fortunately, I was around in time to crank the thing down, and avoid casualties. My sincere apologies to the fish. :cry: There is a flaw however. A tiny little snail that ventures in the way of bubbles can easily throw them out of their path. Perhaps, Hagen's engineers are already looking into some improvements. This diffuser sells for about $20. Thumbs up ... :thumbs: Edited December 20, 2005 by Milan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mighty Prawn Posted December 20, 2005 Report Share Posted December 20, 2005 An easy way for them to fix that problem is as simple as putting an acrylic screen over the side of the entire thing. That way snails can't get in, and co2 can get out. Why they didn't think of that already, I don't know. -Hideo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pat Posted December 20, 2005 Report Share Posted December 20, 2005 I haven't seen the unit up close. But wouldn't blocking the side reduce water circulation which in turn reduce the CO2 absorption rate into the water? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milan Posted December 20, 2005 Author Report Share Posted December 20, 2005 Some more observations! ... In the beginning, while the plastic is still spanking new, it takes few hours until bubbles start nicely climbing their way up. I also tried to apply some water circulation from a powerhead directed toward the ladder, but that completely impaired the thing. Snails get into the ladder during night, when the CO2 is shut off. Once the bubbles start harassing them, they let go. The most persistent one stayed there for about 3 hours battling bubbles. Didn't have a chance to verify, but I would imagine similar if not worse thing would be with any other debris. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magicide Posted December 20, 2005 Report Share Posted December 20, 2005 I used one for awhile with my pressure CO2 system but gave it up. The ladder tends to gunk up with algae and other aquarium byproducts easily since it has such a large surface area. I ended up getting a passive diffusor from Aquagiant that works well. Hook the CO2 up to it, it pumps it into a bell and the CO2 comes out of a rock like cap at the top of the bell. The bubbles come out so fine that they don't even reach the surface of the tank. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vallisneria Posted December 20, 2005 Report Share Posted December 20, 2005 I ended up getting a passive diffusor from Aquagiant that works well. Hook the CO2 up to it, it pumps it into a bell and the CO2 comes out of a rock like cap at the top of the bell. The bubbles come out so fine that they don't even reach the surface of the tank. Do you have pics of this diffuser? I"d be interested to see it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jvision Posted December 20, 2005 Report Share Posted December 20, 2005 I also tried to apply some water circulation from a powerhead directed toward the ladder, but that completely impaired the thing. My best results came when I placed a powerhead or filter output directly above the ladder, pointing across or down and away from it. Brought plenty of "new" water in contact with the bubbles and saw dissolution rates climb. Was able to lower the bubble rate to about 1-1.5/sec. I used one for awhile with my pressure CO2 system but gave it up. The ladder tends to gunk up with algae and other aquarium byproducts easily since it has such a large surface area. One of the best ways to combat algae is to make sure plants are happy. Algae can't out-compete plants when plants are fed well; however, when there is a lack of one or more nutrients, algae will win. As far as other byproducts are concerned, the above-mentioned method helps keep it clear of debris. One thing to note, I've had numerous plants block the path of the bubbles. So, keep it away from plants that have any horizontal growth. Should do well behind a stand of Val. or a Sword. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magicide Posted December 20, 2005 Report Share Posted December 20, 2005 I ended up getting a passive diffusor from Aquagiant that works well. Hook the CO2 up to it, it pumps it into a bell and the CO2 comes out of a rock like cap at the top of the bell. The bubbles come out so fine that they don't even reach the surface of the tank. Do you have pics of this diffuser? I"d be interested to see it. I'll see if I can find it online, otherwise we are getting the old man a digital camera for Christmas. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toirtis Posted December 20, 2005 Report Share Posted December 20, 2005 The Aquagiant ones are sintered glass bell diffusors much like the Amano ones....they carry about 5 different sizes ranging from $7-$18....if they are even half as good as the Amanos, they are fantastic. the smallest ones look like this: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
midgetwaiter Posted December 20, 2005 Report Share Posted December 20, 2005 Chris do you still want me to get you a couple of those while I'm up there? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magicide Posted December 20, 2005 Report Share Posted December 20, 2005 The Aquagiant ones are sintered glass bell diffusors much like the Amano ones....they carry about 5 different sizes ranging from $7-$18....if they are even half as good as the Amanos, they are fantastic. the smallest ones look like this: Yes, it's a design like this one. The head is a bit narrower but the bubbles it makes are excellent. The only thing I don't like, in fact I very much hate, is that there is no easy way to attach it to the back of the tank. I had to take suction cups from my old Hagen ladder and use fishing line to attach them to the Aquagiant diffusor. Other than that though they are far superior to the ladder. I currently have the bubble stream going up into the filter outflow a few inches below the water surface where the bubbles have all but disappeared into the water. Is this spreading it through the water or is the agitation just causing it to escape out of the tank? The surface water itself is smooth as glass. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jvision Posted December 20, 2005 Report Share Posted December 20, 2005 I currently have the bubble stream going up into the filter outflow a few inches below the water surface where the bubbles have all but disappeared into the water. Is this spreading it through the water or is the agitation just causing it to escape out of the tank? The surface water itself is smooth as glass. IMO/IME, it's dissolving. According to many on the APD, the CO2 mist is by far a superior way of getting it to the plants. In fact, having the tiny bubbles come in contact with leaf surfaces may be the ultimat goal. When I started feeding a venturi of bubbles into the intake of a couple of powerheads, instead of using the ladder, growth really took off! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toirtis Posted December 20, 2005 Report Share Posted December 20, 2005 Chris do you still want me to get you a couple of those while I'm up there? Nah...I'm going up with Wayne on Thursday...I'll snag them then....thanks anyways. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vallisneria Posted December 21, 2005 Report Share Posted December 21, 2005 Yes, it's a design like this one. The head is a bit narrower but the bubbles it makes are excellent. would this type of diffuser work with DIY CO2? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magicide Posted December 21, 2005 Report Share Posted December 21, 2005 The only difference in the DIY system and my pressure system is the source. I don't see why you couldn't hook this up to a yeast generator. You wouldn't get as many bubbles of course but once it got going it should work just the same. They have them at Aquagiant for $15 or less depending on the model you get. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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