herefishyfish fishy Posted March 6, 2008 Report Share Posted March 6, 2008 So I got what I believe is a pair of white calvus. I purchased a group of them and they slowly died off over the first few months till just these two were left. I believe they are male and female because the shape of their top fin is different. They now live happily in my sparsly populated 72G community tank. I have a couple smaller tanks that I am thinking of puttiong just them in and seeing what happens. Just looking for some tips and tricks. I am not trying to make a living or money at this just think it would be cool to breed some of my own. Any info you all have would be appreciated. Thanks J Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JORG Posted March 6, 2008 Report Share Posted March 6, 2008 I don't currently keep calvus. But if I had 2 that I thought were a pair and wanted them to breed I would stick them in a 15 to 30 gal tank put in some pvc pipe,flowerpots or large shells and feed them a good diet for a month then do a 50% water change to trigger them too breed--works on all my lamps that I don't keep in a community tank, except my albino daffadils Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
herefishyfish fishy Posted March 7, 2008 Author Report Share Posted March 7, 2008 Thanks JORG might be worth a try. Pairs only right? these fish wont breed in groups? just wondering because I got two more yesterday. The males have been "posing off" ever since. Fun to watch not like peacocks who just put the chase on. These guys are just slowly moving around each other showing their size and fins. ALBINO DAFADILS? huh never heard of those and I love those fish. Don't suppose you have a picture do ya? that would be cool. thanks again for your suggestion. J I don't currently keep calvus. But if I had 2 that I thought were a pair and wanted them to breed I would stick them in a 15 to 30 gal tank put in some pvc pipe,flowerpots or large shells and feed them a good diet for a month then do a 50% water change to trigger them too breed--works on all my lamps that I don't keep in a community tank, except my albino daffadils Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jvision Posted March 7, 2008 Report Share Posted March 7, 2008 AFIK, Calvus don't really tollerate each other outside of the pair. I've never kept these guys to adult (have always changed tank plans before they got big enough), but that's what I've read/heard. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JORG Posted March 7, 2008 Report Share Posted March 7, 2008 I posted a pic of a albino Daffadil in the daily picture thread a while ago Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
herefishyfish fishy Posted March 7, 2008 Author Report Share Posted March 7, 2008 Well after 20 pages and searching I have realized it must be one of the pics that don't come up on my comp. for some reason. Oh well find it sometime. Thanks anyway Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JORG Posted March 7, 2008 Report Share Posted March 7, 2008 Well after 20 pages and searching I have realized it must be one of the pics that don't come up on my comp. for some reason. Oh well find it sometime. Thanks anyway Page 19 post#277 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
herefishyfish fishy Posted March 7, 2008 Author Report Share Posted March 7, 2008 OOPS don't know how I could have missed that. Feel like a real dumbaz. Anyway thanks for that what a cool looking fish that is. I notice that you have alot of kinda oddball fish. Not ones you see everyday. Thats awsome something I aspire to have later in life when I have a house with a fishroom. Thanks again J Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
k9outfit Posted March 10, 2008 Report Share Posted March 10, 2008 Calvus and/or Compressiceps are a 15 (BAP) point fish, not without reason. Definitely not the fish for the novice breeder. You may get them to spawn, but in this case the spawning's the least difficult part of the equation; raising the fry being the real challenge. They're an extremely slow growing fish, and for the 1st 8-10 months are extremely delicate. I would strongly recommend starting with something considerably easier and hardier, for instance Lamprologus ocellatus or something along those lines, if shell dwellers are what you wish to try. ...Just a suggestion so you don't get discouraged before you even start. pvc pipe, flowerpots or large shells I have yet to get mine to spawn in anything other than an appropriate shell; possibly I'm doing something wrong? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fairdeal Posted March 10, 2008 Report Share Posted March 10, 2008 I have some experience with both calvus and compressiceps and would be glad to share what I have been able to pick up over the years. You have heard some practical advice re: not being a fish for beginners and the fact that they breed in some unusual places. There are 2 basic groups of these fish - those that tolerate each other and breed and those that are killed. If I were starting out I would first of all put as many as I was going to have in the tank all at once - no buying a few then a while later a few more then a few more until I had 6 or so and hope that I get at least 1 pair. What I have noticed almost every time that happens is that 1 male becomes dominant and any other males soon become dead. Then the male starts in on the females - those that are not cooperating in the romance department shortly also meet their demise. It is rather important to buy the calvus all around the same age. The males are easily 2 to 3 times the size of the females, but they should all reach sexual maturity around the same time. This will give you at least a fighting chance. These fish are deceivingly docile when you are not looking, but watch out when you are not around. I had 1 wild caught black male and 4 wild caught females all from the same bunch and within 3 weeks of putting them in a 48G 3 of the females were dead and the lone survivor was so terrified that she wedged herself in the rocks so tightly that the male could not reach her and she only dashed out quick enough to grab food as it went by and then darted right back into her little retreat. After a month of that she started venturing out and approaching the male to get his reaction and he suddenly decided that she was a looker. They have been happily attached ever since and she breeds regularly every 3 weeks or so. My wild caught white male however decided that he didn't like any of the females and killed all 3 of them in a matter of again about 3 weeks. He is a loner for the time being as I have not purchased any females for him and don't even know if I will. Maybe it's just mine, but killing a female a week seems to satisfy the males. They don't go on a rampage and do it all at once, so just when you're hoping everything is now fine they go and upset you again. These fish are carnivores and they must be fed a meaty diet to bring the females into breeding condition. So flake food is not going to do the job. They need european shrimp mix, NLS pellets, krill, shrimp, etc. Breeding takes a lot out of them and they must have the strength to cope with the demands of a breeding male and I think they know what will happen if they refuse once too often. A male can mate with multiple females - my oldest male just has the 1 female, but my other wild caught black has 3 females, but only breeds with 2 regularly and my wild caught goldhead regularly breeds with 5 females. The goldhead also tolerates one subdominant male as long as he does not approach any of his females. Interestingly enough these fish are ones where I have never witnessed the actual breeding. Fronts are sometimes very secretive, but I have seen them breed many times, but never a calvus or compressiceps. If you watch closely every day and suddenly notice the female hanging around a shell or inside a cave it is a pretty good indicator that within a few days there will be eggs magically appear. If this is not happening after awhile then it is probably time to change things around and offer her something different. Once she has selected a site she should use it every time, but you have to get her kick started by giving her something she likes. Water temperature doesn't seem to be a deciding factor in the breeding - range of 78 to 80 seems to work fine for mine. Water changes however are compulsory every week. I have read that these fish don't like changes of more than 20 to 25%, but somehow mine get weekly changes of at least 1/3 and do just fine thank you. In the front tanks sometimes they get a 40% change. Always use Prime or some similar product with every change. Which now brings up the subject of suitable tankmates. You may want to experiment a bit if you don't have room for a species specific tank, but I don't believe that you are going to get these fish to breed in an mbuna tank. As far as I can determine they do best with other layed back fish - peacocks, fronts, etc. Other people may have success with more active fish but I have always put them with the fish mentioned. I would also suggest multiple hiding or retreat areas in whatever tank you use for the simple reason that if your male goes phycho all of a sudden the females will need a spot too small for him to get into. The breeding caves can be clustered or seperated - whatever seems to work. But leave some room in between so they don't feel cramped. The males I have seem to enjoy the clustering so they can patrol the area and keep their eyes on things. Even a couple of inches apart seems to be fine. These fish are jumpers when startled so keep all the open spaces at the top of your tank sealed as well as you possibly can. Nothing puts a lump in your throat quite like getting a breeding pair all nicely settled in and then finding one of them on the floor all dried up. This usually happens at lights on and lights off and you can hear them splashing around in the tank when they do become startled. When the excitement of finding eggs in the cave wears off it is time to decide the magic momement of when do you actually take the fry out. Even if the fish are alone in the tank I do think that the male would pick them off as soon as he had a chance so the remedy is to always remove the temptation. I find that when the fry are scurring around on their own, but still with the eggsac, is the best time. They are not old enough to actually venture out on their own but are getting mobile and can travel from the back to the front of the cave with little effort. The females become very vigilant at this stage and will attack anything, including hands, that get too close to her brood. I usually put a net between the female and the entrance as soon as she ventures out and they chomp on them pretty good. Then into the breeding traps and start feeding them the smallest fry food you can get. Because they are egglayers DO NOT put the fry in a tumbler - not necessary at all and would probably kill them anyway. I use Better Than Brine as a starter, but really well crushed NLS or flake would work too I guess. Whatever it is make sure it is high protein (50% or higher) and high fat (15% or higher). I find that even Cyclop Eeze is too big for them initially and keep them on the really small food for at least 2 weeks. The trick to feeding them is usually in how much and it does take a little experimenting. The best I can offer is to look at their bellies when you have fed them and determine if they look full enough. They should be nice and plump, but not to the point of exploding and if they are not plump then try a little more the next time. I don't have the luxury of feeding 3 or 4 times a day so mine have to go between meals for as long as 12 hours and I do have some mortality issues from time to time. To alleviate that as much as possible I crush NLS H2O wafers and put some in the tank and they learn to nibble on them so they do get some nutrition during the day when I'm gone. That being said they will often not do a very good job on the nibbling and the reason for the NLS is that it doesn't break down and fowl the water if they don't manage to feed on it like I expect them to. I think from what I can remember that it can actually remain in the tank water for 48 hours or longer before water issues arise. Now you just sit back and patiently wait for 6 months or so and hope that by then they have hit the 1" mark. Once they are that size the problems are hopefully pretty much over. They are an incredibly slow growing fish and even the 3 day water changes for them don't seem to speed things along a whole lot. I even tried every day water changes (but only 10 to 15% or so) and the results appeared to be about the same as the every 3 days. Well that's all I can think of for now - the brain seems to be fizzling out for some reason. LOL Will post again when I think of something I missed and I'm sure there is a lot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
herefishyfish fishy Posted March 11, 2008 Author Report Share Posted March 11, 2008 WOW!!! sign me up for the first copy of your book when you publish.lol Thanks a bunch you have made me realise that when and if I do this it will be quite the ordeal. I thought I might just put them in a tank alone do a bunch of water changes and poof babies. I guess if it was that easy everybody would be a breeder. Thanks again for all that I will keep it handy for the future. P.S. how's those Longfins you stole? hahahahahaha! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fairdeal Posted March 11, 2008 Report Share Posted March 11, 2008 I just want to reiterate that this is my own personal experiences and it was with wild caughts. I hope someone else that has some experience with maybe F1's or F2's could shed a little light on the behaviour of their calvus or compressiceps. All I can tell you is that WC are a pain in the butt until they sort things out and at $50 to $60 each it was a pretty expensive sorting out. I didn't want to give a discertation, but once I got started I kept thinking of more things and just kept going. LOL I don't mind sharing my experiences at all with other fish enthusiasts. I also didn't want to discourage anyone from enjoying these beautiful fish either or trying to breed them. Maybe I just ran into a streak of misbehaviour that nobody else has gone through. That's why I'm hoping other breeders wouldn't mind sharing something. The long fins are doing great by the way. Haven't started breeding yet though. LOL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
k9outfit Posted March 12, 2008 Report Share Posted March 12, 2008 My experience has been similar, though I didn't actually loose any fish; I seperated the Compressiceps before the pair anihilated the other two. Now the other two are also in seperate tanks, since my 180 didn't seem large enough for them both, even though they're opposite sexes. My Calvus seem a bit more tolerant of each other; there's 6 (4 males, 2 females) in one of my 90s. These are F1s, and all from the same batch. So far, they haven't tried killing each other, though I think I'll be needing to seperate them shortly. My intent is not to be discouraging, quite the contrary. Success is what gives a person confidence, and confidence is what motivates most of us to try ever more challenging species, and also helps us overcome failures along the way. On the other hand, setting one's self up for failure by starting off trying to spawn a difficult or delicate species is the quickest way to abandon this hobby. Also, successes give us the experience necessary to be able to trouble-shoot effectively when suddenly all the fry die off for no apparent reason. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
herefishyfish fishy Posted March 13, 2008 Author Report Share Posted March 13, 2008 Thanks K9 as you all have stated not a beginers fish to breed. I respect that and think that now is definitly not the time to try as I live in a apt. and only have one little 10G as an extra tank when needed. I think i will take all of your advice and hold off untill I am more equipted to deal with all the unexpected. I really appreciate all the serious feedback you all have given, I wish I knew about this site 3 yrs ago when I started. Iwould have saved alot of time, money and fish! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
victornguyen Posted March 14, 2008 Report Share Posted March 14, 2008 I used to breed Calvus and comps for many years. I had more babies than i knew what to do with. I find it a success if you breed them in groupd. i had 1-2 males with 5-6 females. they dont form true pairs but rather breed with every female they can get a hold of. best piece of equipment is the cone shape caves and not those free standing calvus caves. I fed the brine shrimp and cyclopeeze without any deaths. I sold over a thousand healthy little ones in the last 2 years in Calgary. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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