Ray tank info needed

[mossman]

Might as well start off with a little introduction, new to these forums, strictly been on reef forums only glad to see a local active forum.

Well, currently I have a full blown reef setup which I’m contemplating taking down and switching sides and taking a dive into freshwater.

I've been doing quite a bit of research and alot of it seems dated so I was hoping to get an opinion of a few experienced ray keepers. I've maintained a full blown SPS reef for over 2 years so I’m quite adapt to marine husbandry, water chemistry etc. and I’m looking forward to the challenge of stingrays.

I’m currently looking at only housing one ray for now and maybe in the future a pair at max, species isn’t decided but more than likely a hardier smaller species. A custom tank will be built for the footprint I am undecided but I’m thinking along the lines of either 4’ x 4’ or 5’ x 3’ maybe even push it to 6’ x 4’. My question is how are current ray keepers running their tanks? With high end canister filters or are you implementing a sump? I’m no stranger to a complex sump and that’s the way I’m leaning towards but if canisters can get the job done then why not.

Also what kind of flow are you pushing through your tanks, just enough for no dead spots or do you got a wave going through the tank. Also any stores in particular to deal with for sting rays. Any suggestions for rays for a beginner,

tips, comments, and criticisms are all welcome. I would love it if anybody in Calgary wouldn’t mind showing me there ray setup

Thanks,

[pagani]

The larger the footprint the better, go for 6' x 4' if you can. I make sure there is tons of circulation when they rays thrash around or hide in the sand the waste and small food particles get sucked into the three cansister I have. I also use a heater with a protective cover to make sure the rays stay safe, they can burn very easily. The temperature, the higher the better I keep mine at around 86F it keeps my arowana happy aswell. For filtration the more the better too, I have about 265 gallons of filtration on my 125 gallon tank (the rays are still young.) When it comes to feeding, a fat stingray is a happy stingray, nightcrawlers, market shrimp, massivore pellets, and especially smelt are some food stingrays usually take a liking to. I feed my rays Hikari Massivore pellets, uncooked prawn, and a few nightcrawlers every now and then, I feed three times a day. There's alot more too keeping rays but my computer is about to die. Just remember keep the water as clean as possible, feed lots with a variety and the more space the better.

[jvision]

I agree with the 6x4 footprint - larger is ALWAYS better! Really, who can stay with just 1 ray - it won't take long before you add another, and maybe some 'dithers'. Personally, I'd do a sump for several reasons. Mainly b/c you have the ability to get way more biofiltration and you have somewhere to hide the heater. As far as flow is concerned, you don't need the massive amounts your corals appreciate, but you'll want enough so that waste can easily be pushed to the overflow. Rays are riverine animals, so they appreciate some good flow.

[skynoch]

As everyone said the larger the footprint the better. Your footprint may also vary if you decide you want other tankmates, type of ray, and if you want your rays to breed in the future. If the 6' length is as long as you can go then you will want the 6' x 4'. If your just keeping rays and some other bottom dwellers and don't care about breeding then a height of 18" is fine. If you want to keep some aros and other top-mid level tankmates or are looking to breed your rays the 24-30" would be better. In this footprint of a tank I would reccomend a trio (2f,1m) of hystrix,scobina, or rectics. Rectics usually are poorly shipped and usually are hard to get eating or to keep alive due to that fact, even if your ray seems to be doing good it may die for what seems to be no reason. Scobina and hystrix are hard to find. The other way to go with this tank is to keep 1 maybe 2 males of the other hardier types like motoro,pearl,marble,xingu ect... Stay away from tigers,castexi,flowers,henlie,leo and females of these types. Your males seem to grow around 16" but can top out arond 24" while females will grow around 24" and can top out around 30".

If you can lengthen your tank a 8' x 3'+ will house a trio of most rays besides your flowers,tigers, and castexi's for life.

As for filtration the more the better again. I would reccomend a sump with the first section housing a filter sock and then a wet/dry secton followed by a large sump area to hold more bio media,pumps, and heaters.

Inside your tank make sure to add some powerheads or something similar to clear deadspots. I find my rays will play in the current at times but will avoid it at times so this will be something you will want to play with. I allways put in a large bubble disc or bar as the rays will play in this or just sit on it at times if thier disc has been damaged or irratted. Your bottom can either be bare or smooth sand/very fine river gravel. When the rays are pups have your sand only about 1/16-1/8" thick and as thy get bigger and are able to blow deeper into the sand you can go deeper.

As far as lighting goes rays will be more comfortable with minimal lighting.

While your on the planning stage I would also plan for a drip system as rays require a tremendous amount of water changes.

As where to buy rays will all depend on what type of ray you are interested on buying.

Hope this helps

Edited February 18, 2010 by skynoch

[RD.]

And seeing as Scott appears to be too modest to toot his own horn, I'll do it for him.

http://albertaaquatica.com/index.php?showtopic=27973

Definitely worth checking out before you go shopping elsewhere.

[pagani]

DEfinitly go to Scott for rays, top quality, awesome prices, he does trades on almost anything too. I have a couple pearl motoros from him, I had a motoro too but after keeping the pearl motoros I never want a motoro again because they're so boring looking compared to the other rays. He lives way out in drayton valley but I'm sure he'd meet you somewhere.

[skynoch]

Thanks guys for the comments

[mossman]

Great advice so far, I got plenty of questions so keep it coming!

Pagani- you keep your tank at 86F seems a little high, any particular reason for keeping it this high?

As far as ray selection and tank footprint, I might have to settle for something a little smaller and wont be able to do 8ft, I know for sure I wont be looking into breeding or housing more than a trio/pair at max in a years time, and prob going with a hardier and easier to come by species for now. Dont plan on adding another massive fish such as an arrowana or anything. So it'll prob be the 1-2 stingrays in the tank only.

So a sump is a must as I can see, which shouldn't be to bad, I'm going to need some advice for a freshwater sump as I believe its going to differ quite a bit from the salt water side. I got a few spare pumps lying around and will be able to push at least 600gph through the returns, and for as far as flow through the tank I have a vortech mp40 and a few K2-K3 which I believe could get the job done. Understand the filter sock portion of the sump.. have it run wet/dry after that with a massive amount of bioballs? then to a return section which can house the pump and heaters. Anything i'm missing, as the sump is the main thing i'm struggling with not to familar with the whole wet/dry as bioballs are unholy in salwater lol

Skynoch you mentioned a drip system?

Also does anybody use R/O DI water on there systems? I have a current R/O system just wondering if it'd be any use for me still.

I'd love to buy a ray off a fellow member rather than a chain store, hopefully Scott still has some for sale when I got everything up and running.

[pagani]

High temps keep desease at bay and heals wounds faster. My fish are top quality and in great health as a result of warm temps, fequent water changes and good food.

[Mareshow]

i keep my tank at 85F, but i have discus with my rays. the higher temp increases their metabolism thus making them crap more though lol, i totally agree with skynoch however, if you can do a 8'x3' you will be beyond happy thats a perfect tank for many other fish, including asian arowanas and pang long diablo reds are GORGEOUS!

oh and just so you know here are my scobinas, so if you're willing to wait a couple years for pups...

Edited February 20, 2010 by Mareshow

[African_Fever]

Personally, I've found my rays do much better around 80 than at higher temps. They eat way more at 80 than at 86, and are much more active as well. I would've thought that the higher temps would've meant an increased metabolism in my rays, but for whatever reason it doesn't (at least not with mine), and the first clue I always get that my temp has crept up is that they aren't eating nearly as much and aren't as active.

The drip system that Skynoch mentioned is basically a continual water change. Water is added to the sump at a slow 'drip' and the excess overflows to a drain. If you can do it, it's definitely well worth the time and effort involved and can drastically cut down on any water issues you might encounter.

[hybrid]

keeping your temp at 80-82 will not only keep your rays more active, it will allow you to raise the temp if you ever need to treat ich,etc..

Edited February 21, 2010 by hybrid

[mossman]

Thanks for the temp info, never kept any of my tanks aruond that high always usually 78-79.

Anybody using R/O water? Plus anybody using a sump if you wouldn't mind taking a quick picture it'd be quite helpful. Or any sump designs for that matter. As i got no clue for a freshwater sump thats to include bioballs etc.