ABwildrose Posted March 28, 2005 Report Share Posted March 28, 2005 Well, when I read Jodayes post, I thought I was reading my own for a second. I sent this pm to dunl a few days ago, but perhaps the best place is to put it here. I had ich one other time a couple years ago and I only lost 1 fish and it cleared up really quickly. This time it has been a nightmare. I obviously made a huge mistake somewhere. I would like to figure out what that mistake was so I don't ever repeat it. I first noticed the ich spots on 2 of my acei on the Fri after the auction. I raised the temp to 80 and I read 80 was fine for this. I vaccuumed the substrate and did a small water change before treating with malachite green (Nox-ich) at half strength (because of the synos) as directed. I have kept the lights off the entire time plus it is dark in the basement otherwise. By Sunday, things were looking worse with more fish with the spots. I took out all of the rock, vacced every spot of the substrate while changing about 30% water. I left the water low so there was good surface movement from the powerhead and filter outflow. I put in a new slate cave thing and their favorite wood root thing so they could hide. I treated with Nox-ich half strength daily Sun, Mon and Tues. They were looking way worse. ammonia, nitites were zero. nitrates about 30. I had my first 4 casualtys by Wed a.m. ...most fish were looking really rough. I was only feeding them sparingly, some didn't even want to eat. I started looking up different treatments for ich and found the one where it says to use salt. Thurs morning, I did a 20% water change and started to add salt gradually increasing to 3 tsp/gal after 36 hrs(reached this concentration Fri morning. I did notice a slight improvement in general after the first addition of salt....but they still dropped off regularly, like a couple every 12 hrs. Fri Water tests showed ammonia and nitrites zero, nitrates 40. I did another 30% water change. Sat morning I lost 2 more acei. I haven't lost any more since . The others are still eating. It seems my largest/oldest fish died first (all the nice ones from a couple different breeders), the smaller ones (run of the mill ones from lfs) don't look as bad. I lost 1 syn multi and 2 petricolas as well. First off...I didn't quarantine the fish from the auction. I don't really think they are the culprits tho as they are the least affected fish. In order for so many to have died and for this to have gotten so out of hand, I suspect I had it going on a lot longer than I noticed. At least before I added these new guys. Secondly...I should have tried the salt in the water first instead of the malachite green. I was wanting to use medication as I had it on hand and thought it would be more effective. Thirdly...I just realized a few days ago that the Nox-ich I used was perhaps too old to be effective. It has to be at least 2 yrs old as I bought it 2 years ago. There is no expiry date. It obviously had no effect on my biological filter as I was testing my water expecting a cycle crash and it was fine. The ich got progressively worse with treatment. Anone have any more comments/suggestions that will help me for next time? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ABwildrose Posted March 29, 2005 Author Report Share Posted March 29, 2005 the list of the fish I lost are: 4 tropheops yellow/yellow 5 ps acei "black tanzanian" or orange tail 1 syn multipunctatus 2 syno petricola 2 msobo survivors are: 3 syno multipunctatus 1 syno petricola 3 rock kribs 4 yellow labs 2 acei 1 hybrid blue/yellow mbuna Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chloeclose Posted March 29, 2005 Report Share Posted March 29, 2005 Awww I'm sorry Shelley. Sorry I can't be more helpful... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jods2518 Posted March 29, 2005 Report Share Posted March 29, 2005 I feel your pain sister...still no idea what happened to my tank either..... -05- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vallisneria Posted March 29, 2005 Report Share Posted March 29, 2005 So sorry to hear that Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rahim101 Posted March 29, 2005 Report Share Posted March 29, 2005 I had an issue with some of the fish I got from the auction as well. My 90 gallon is now plagued with BLOAT and I have lost my first fish. It may not be dur to the poor quatlity of fish purchased, but more so of stressed fish being in a cold room for such a long time and the stress that goes with that. I too, did not quarantine the new fish and am going through the expensive BLOAT treatment right now. All the others seem to be fine for now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
African_Fever Posted March 29, 2005 Report Share Posted March 29, 2005 I had bloat as well with the new fish from the auction, and would definitely attribute it to the cold conditions and stress of the auction. Not too sure why the door was left open, I wore my coat almost the whole time I was inside and never once found it too warm. My bloat was cleared up within a week (after isolation and treating with clout), and things are back to normal (at least they appear to be) with no losses to date. Good luck with the rest of your treatments! I know how stressful it can be! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
birger Posted March 29, 2005 Report Share Posted March 29, 2005 I found it down right cold at the auction as well and had written off the fish I purchased there but luckily they survived with no problems. I raised the temp to 80 As far as the ich problem if you were going with the high heat technique the heat has to go up to 84 or higher to be affective.I have used it on catfish with no problem but have never had to use it on rift cichlids but if I remember right they do not like the high temps.(especially tangy's) don't really think they are the culprits A fish could bring it in with it and not be to affected itself but could infect others. I am a believer in putting fish in quarantine and you may never know what kind of problems you saved for yourself,but I am sure we have all thrown a fish in "just this once" and ended up with problems. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RD. Posted March 29, 2005 Report Share Posted March 29, 2005 First off...I didn't quarantine the fish from the auction. I don't really think they are the culprits tho as they are the least affected fish. I suspect that they are indeed the culprits. Shelli has a great post on treating ich with salt & high temps, here: http://www.cichlid-forum.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=26234 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
African_Fever Posted March 29, 2005 Report Share Posted March 29, 2005 The temp for Malawians could even go higher still. When I was diving at Lion's Cove the temp at 86 feet was 86f, so they can live with the higher temp as long as your filtration and water movement keep up (less dissolved O2 at higher water temps). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nyasa Posted March 29, 2005 Report Share Posted March 29, 2005 Hey Shelley, Sorry to hear about your losses. Hope the rest of your gang pulls through this. David. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ABwildrose Posted March 29, 2005 Author Report Share Posted March 29, 2005 I had the temp at 82 for one day until it got colder outside, then it seemed the heaters couldn't keep up. They were both on almost continuously, so I set them to 80 instead so I didnt get a big temp variation. Of course, I could have added another heater Next time I am using salt first thing. I found that article from Shelli over on cichlid forum. I should have read that when I first started treating this. Maybe It should be pinned here in the disease section so it is easy to find. All the rest of my fish are fine, eating well etc. When I was putting them in the tank my husband said "I thought you told me you should keep new fish separate for a while before putting them in with the rest....so they don't spread some kind of disease." So, of course he has to point that he warned me and I didnt listen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rahim101 Posted March 30, 2005 Report Share Posted March 30, 2005 Send me the link to the article and I will PIN it for all to see!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ABwildrose Posted March 30, 2005 Author Report Share Posted March 30, 2005 Here is the article http://cichlid-forum.com/articles/ich.php It is very good. I am not sure, but should we get permission from her before using it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cichlid88 Posted March 30, 2005 Report Share Posted March 30, 2005 Sorry to hear about your loss.. You right though, the heat and salt seems work best and over the past number of years it as proven it's self again and again, for my discus, africans, and angels. I have found that keeping a low level of salt in my tanks all the time ( 1tbsp per 10 gallons) as well as the temp at the higher end of the scale all the time and replenishing during water changes seems to cut down on the losses and keep most parasites at bay. If something does seem to get out of hand the salt is increased and temp pushed up to 84-86 which usually works after a couple of days. Best Of Luck, Bernie :beer: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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